[cichlid]

I have not changed my riding habits in the last year and have never received a speeding fine until recently.

In the month of March I have received 3!!

84km/h in a 80km/h speed zone, 1 demerit point and $128.00 fine
108km/h in a 100km/h speed zone, 1 demerit point and $128.00 fine
65km/h in a 60km/h speed zone, 1 demerit point and $128.00 fine.

I really struggle to understand the logic here. None of the above represent dangerous or life threatening behavior on the road.

Has Vic roads upgraded all there camera's to rear firing recently??

There must be a way to protect myself from these ridiculous fines. Do they know how difficult it is to keep a Fireblade spot on or just under the speed limit????

Thanks for listening.

[Newfie TLR]

Originally Posted by cichlid

There must be a way to protect myself from these ridiculous fines. .

Slow down??

Originally Posted by cichlid

Do they know how difficult it is to keep a Fireblade spot on or just under the speed limit????.

Be very careful who you say that to. It's more ammunition for those who want high powered sportbikes off the roads.

[luvtolean]

4 km/h over? Sheeze!

They're out revenue collecting man. Pay the gun totin' tax-men!

[Will]

Don't like it? DONT SPEED
yes, they are A holes but if you don't go over the speed limit they can't ping you
I've ridden both 929 and now 954 fireblades for the past 3 years, I've never had a ticket and I have no problem riding my bike under the posted limit.
Perhaps it's you the rider not the bike.

[RPinOZ]

Originally Posted by Will

Don't like it? DONT SPEED

Or move to a state that isn't quite so gung ho on revenue collecting which is all it is. Is the Vic road toll any lower as a result? I don't think so.
Or take your number plate off

[CBRVFR]

I hear that a 12 gauge deer slug does wonders for the calibration of such devices....

[ndj]

The day will come when all bikes (and cars) are fitted with a GPS and transmitter that will let the police computer know exactly where you are and how fast you are going. Aeroplanes have had something similar for quite a while now so it's not science fiction.

Then, when you exceed the speed limit slightly you will get a warning. If you exceed it still further you will incur a further warning and notification that you have received a fine and demerit points. If you still continue to speed you will receive another fine and warning; AND if you still continue to speed your vehicle will be immobilized and you will be notified that the police are on their way to arrest you. You will never be able to seriously exceed the speed limit as your vehicle would be immobilized before you could do much over the legal limit. Of course, 280kmh motorcycles would have long being phased out as "unnecessary" in such a future world.

So enjoy your riding while you can. I give the present system 5-10 years.

[RPinOZ]

Wotchu smokin' ndj?

[ndj]

OK, so maybe I was a bit melodramatic and alarmist. Maybe it will take longer than 5-10 years - but it will happen. If some years ago someone had warned that one day there would be speed cameras many people would have laughed and said "It'll never happen" - but it has.

Already, it is hard to ride or drive a sporty machine without racking up fines regularly. I had a Toyota Supra Twin turbo and ended up selling it after realising that I couldn't ever get the turbos on song without nervously looking ahead for a speed camera. Now I drive a 1000cc 3 cylinder Daihatsu Charade.

With the bikes - it's still not too bad as in WA the speed cameras take photos from the front and we don't have front number plates (yet). But as we speak pollies are discussing way to either fit the number plates or find another way to catch "speeding bikers". Electronic tracking is one the ways suggested according to newspaper reports.

Considering the pace at which modern technology advances - why wouldn't the government introduce electronic measures to control traffic? They already collect tolls this way in the eastern states.

[Baketech]

Originally Posted by RPinOZ

Wotchu smokin' ndj?

Probably a "preload" reefer.....

[RPinOZ]

Originally Posted by ndj

OK, so maybe I was a bit melodramatic and alarmist. Maybe it will take longer than 5-10 years - but it will happen. If some years ago someone had warned that one day there would be speed cameras many people would have laughed and said "It'll never happen" - but it has.

That's because not too many people are opposed to speed cameras.
Nobody wants to be trackable by the authorities. Why do you think Australia Card didn't get off the ground? (for all you non-Aussies, this was a proposed universal electronic ID card which you would use in a scanner connected to a big brother type computer for all ID type things. A bit like having a chip implant. It didn't get voted in.)

Originally Posted by ndj

Considering the pace at which modern technology advances - why wouldn't the government introduce electronic measures to control traffic? They already collect tolls this way in the eastern states.

Because it is too dangerous controlling vehicles remotely.

[stegen]

damn, isnt 4 kmh like 1.5 mph?

[RPinOZ]

Originally Posted by stegen

damn, isnt 4 kmh like 1.5 mph?

Nope its a whole reckless 2.4 mph over
Obviously this sort of criminal behaviour needs to be curtailed.

[Northern RR]

Originally Posted by cichlid

I
84km/h in a 80km/h speed zone, 1 demerit point and $128.00 fine
108km/h in a 100km/h speed zone, 1 demerit point and $128.00 fine
65km/h in a 60km/h speed zone, 1 demerit point and $128.00 fine.

I am seeing a pattern, speed up to at least 195-200 and point the licence plate at the ground(the best method is on one wheel) then see how many you get? can't ticket what they can't read?

Really though, that sucks a LOT, what a money grab...that is a lot of money to pay out for "stupid" tickets.

[ndj]

Originally Posted by RPinOZ

That's because not too many people are opposed to speed cameras.
Nobody wants to be trackable by the authorities. Why do you think Australia Card didn't get off the ground? (for all you non-Aussies, this was a proposed universal electronic ID card which you would use in a scanner connected to a big brother type computer for all ID type things. A bit like having a chip implant. It didn't get voted in.)

ID cards and chip implants on individuals are different . (No way of generating revenue with them for a start).

As for tracking vehicles: It'll get in under the guise of "the innocent have nothing to fear." They'll say they only need to know your vehicle's speed and location so as to be able to determine the correct penalty.

I'm willing to bet 90% of pensioners in our "aging society" would support electronic speed monitors just as they did speed cameras, surveillance cameras, etc.

I'd be interested to know: on what basis would you argue against such a device without being out-debated by the pro-tracking lobby?
I don't remember voting for speed cameras btw.

[ndj]

I once went on talk back radio to argue against the Chief of the RACWA (Royal Automobile Club of Western Australia) who was saying the motorcycles needed to be fitted with front number plates as too many riders were "getting away" with speeding.

I argued that with motorcycles only forming about 3% of road vehicles (of which only a small proportion speed) - why all the attention on them? If reducing the road toll was the goal surely there were better ways to spend road safety money? I pointed out that studies revealed that in Australia speeding is a contributing factor in only 5% of crashes, while inattention and disobeying traffic rules (excluding speed) contributed in 39% and 31% of all crashes respectively and that 68% of motorcycle crashes are the fault of the other driver.
Why not fund a "look for motorcycles before you turn, pull out or change lanes" TV safety advertisment, instead of front number plates, I asked?

Suffice to say I was shouted down not only by the radio show host, but the RACAW guy and countless callers that continued to call for hours afterward to voice their outrage against motorcycles. They all said I was a typical motorcyclist trying to get away with speeding, that my facts were wrong as "everybody knows" that motorcylists speed, ride recklessly and put themselves in danger, etc, etc. NOT ONE person called in to support my argument.

Face it guys - it's a losing battle. Look on the bright side - you won't have to worry about your kids' lives and limbs when they're out riding their 30kph electric motorcyles in the future. Also you'll be able to entertain them with rip-roaring yarns of life in the old days (tankslappers at 200kmh, etc). And they'll be like "grandpa! But that's against the law! - what were you thinking!"

[RPinOZ]

Originally Posted by ndj

I'd be interested to know: on what basis would you argue against such a device without being out-debated by the pro-tracking lobby?
I don't remember voting for speed cameras btw.

I would argue that a motorcycle's steering in a corner can be changed by changing it's throttle setting. You can't have a remote immobiliser for motorcycles without playing with people's lives. Imagine you are in an increasing radius corner close to the armco on the inside of the corner and gradually increasing your throttle when suddenly it cuts out. You may hit the armco.

People who don't ride may not understand this but most traffic engineers do. I'm sure they would not support remote control of a motorcycle's engine output.

[ndj]

Originally Posted by RPinOZ

I would argue that a motorcycle's steering in a corner can be changed by changing it's throttle setting. You can't have a remote immobiliser for motorcycles without playing with people's lives. Imagine you are in an increasing radius corner close to the armco on the inside of the corner and gradually increasing your throttle when suddenly it cuts out. You may hit the armco.

People who don't ride may not understand this but most traffic engineers do. I'm sure they would not support remote control of a motorcycle's engine output.

Okay - so they can't immobilize you - but they can sure as hell use their tracking device to give you multiple fines and demerit points. How would you argue against that?
You'd be struggling to make a case I suspect.

[Cowboy1600]

Originally Posted by Northern RR

I am seeing a pattern, speed up to at least 195-200 and point the licence plate at the ground(the best method is on one wheel) then see how many you get? can't ticket what they can't read?

Really though, that sucks a LOT, what a money grab...that is a lot of money to pay out for "stupid" tickets.

Only problem with this logic is you dont know where they are. If you actually knew your about to go thru a camera it would be easier to just slow down.

Its just a money grab. The state government make almost $500,000,000 (half a billion) a year IN VICTORIA ALONE. Thats a state of about 6 million people.

Our ADR's (Australian Design Regulations) state that vehicle speedos, once over 40kph, must be acurate to within 10k's of the actual limit. The tolerances built into the camera network dont allow for this. Its completely ****ed. BTW the toleance is 3kph.

[RPinOZ]

Originally Posted by ndj

Okay - so they can't immobilize you - but they can sure as hell use their tracking device to give you multiple fines and demerit points. How would you argue against that?
You'd be struggling to make a case I suspect.

I would argue against remote tracking of vehicles by citing the laws on privacy which are very strong and have become stronger as technology has become more invasive. I suspect I'd win, at least in the current political climate. The problem with information collected even for legitimate purposes is that it can be abused/sold by people with privileged access to the system who are only human. eg "I know a bloke in Vehicle Tracking who can tell me everywhere my wife drives to when I'm at work" You get my drift. A speed camera doesn't have anything like the same ramifications.

[Intimidator]

Originally Posted by Will

Don't like it? DONT SPEED
yes, they are A holes but if you don't go over the speed limit they can't ping you
I've ridden both 929 and now 954 fireblades for the past 3 years, I've never had a ticket and I have no problem riding my bike under the posted limit.
Perhaps it's you the rider not the bike.

Give me a phucking break. I don't think the guy had one ticket that was the equivalent of more than 6 or 7mph over the limit. EVERYONE surpasses the limit at some point in time, EVERYONE. Those who don't are probably the ones impeding traffic. I guess you're saying that your bike has never been over the highest posted limit in your area? If you've never been on the track....you should've bought a Honda Ruckus. If you do frequent the track, I retract my previous statement. Sorry for the .....no hard feelings.

[ndj]

Originally Posted by RPinOZ

I would argue against remote tracking of vehicles by citing the laws on privacy which are very strong and have become stronger as technology has become more invasive. I suspect I'd win, at least in the current political climate.

I don't think that privacy laws are getting stronger. On the contrary, they are getting eroded as a result of all the panic and propaganda about terrorism.

Yes. Technology has become invasive. Records are kept as to who you phone, what you buy, how much money you have, etc and surveillance cameras are everywhere.

I keep hearing the statements "the innocent have nothing to fear." or "you don't need to worry if you've got nothing to hide."

Originally Posted by RPinOZ

The problem with information collected even for legitimate purposes is that it can be abused/sold by people with privileged access to the system who are only human. eg "I know a bloke in Vehicle Tracking who can tell me everywhere my wife drives to when I'm at work" You get my drift. A speed camera doesn't have anything like the same ramifications.

I agree that information can be abused. When my wife was my girlfriend, she was caught speeding on her CBR600 but let off by a friendly cop. Sadly, he became a bit too friendly, looking up her address and details and then stalking her. Fortunately, he backed off when he realised I was in the picture so we didn't have to take action against him - just as well as it's not good to have a cop as an enemy.

But it's too late. Your info is already being sold to financial institutions, businesses, marketers and spammers every day.
It's only going to get worse.

[Baketech]

You let them take your guns.....now you've let them take your rights to due process....when they come for your motorcycles are you going to even put up a fight...

[oldfogey]

The position in the UK is getting more like Australia by the day:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/4439123.stm

The government needs the money to help pay police costs (strongly rising pension costs mostly) and the voting public don't yet see it as a big issue. Fortunately, GPS devices with updated sites of cameras are legal to give you warning and they are generally set with much bigger tolerance than your Aussie ones. Those tolerances you have been penalised under are really tight .

[Zeeman]

The problem with the Vic system is they are effectively making everyone a criminal, and when the system makes everyone the bad guy, the system has failed.

In NSW, some genious has come up with the idea of making <15km/h over the limit point penalty the same as >15km/h but <30km/h over the limit. So, if you do 108km/h in a 100 zone, or if you do 130km/h in a 100 zone, you still cop 3 points. The only difference is the fine. Farking brilliant. So, of course, all this will mean is anyone who does 110km/h in a 100 zone will now do 130 instead, the penalty is the same, may as well go faster huh?

No idea, I swear. While I understand the for a "limit" and some level of enforcement (we can't have everyone doing as they please) going nanna state will not fix anything.

Z...