What to do if a tankslapper occurs?

thelemur · 07-10-2005, 12:39 PM

I have a steering damper on order, but in case the situation arises before then, or even after for that matter, id like to know what action i should take.

I hear some people say to apply the rear brake, then I hear others say to use no brake at all. Some say to fight it, some say not too.

Whats the best action to take? (aside from not putting yourself into that situation in the first place

)

BDA116 · 07-10-2005, 12:52 PM

Absolutely, positively never fight it. That is the worst thing you could do. All that will accomplish is a ride to the hospital. It depends on the severity, but the best thing to do is nothing at all. Relax your grip, and keep the throttle neutral if not rolled on a touch. The bike doesn't want to slap any more than you want it to, and if kept going forward will usually pull itself out of it.
It can be very difficult to make yourself do, as it goes against many instincts and is hard to real world train yourself for.

929_Nupe · 07-10-2005, 1:23 PM

change your shorts..........

KiwiBlader · 07-10-2005, 2:19 PM

I had a lock-lock nasty on my VTR once at around 200kph(which left a lovely S pattern on the road),I panicked and let off the throttle and pulled the clutch at the same time and it stopped it dead.Terrifying 3 seconds.On my 929 when it starts to go now I either hold the throttle(stop accelerating)or back it off slightly and its all good again.

Red Rider · 07-10-2005, 3:23 PM

Cue TAZ...

maxib · 07-10-2005, 3:26 PM

BDA said everything you need to know. Therefore, I won't repeat. Just do what he said, and change your shorts when you get home.

In the early '80s I had my very first slapper on a litrebike, which was top dog when I bought it in 1976. Statistically speaking, I should have had my first slapper in 1968, but that's another story. I was fortunate to have had a very long straight road after having crested a hill with a bump that set the bike and rider into paint shaker mode.

All alone on my trusty bike (not the big H but a K), the only thought I had was...I'm gonna die! The bars were shaking uncontrollably, and the bike felt to me like I would suppose it would be like riding one of those bulls on the rodeo channel...

I learned three things that day. #1...motorcycles are not inherently safe vehicles. #2...panic is okay as long as you don't do anything stupid,... like grab a brake under these specific circumstances. #3...laundering underwear is a must after the incident.

I suppose the passion we all have drives us to do this sport regardless... Much like jumping out of an aircraft wearing a parachute when knowing all along that the aircraft will safely land when the jumpers might not. We take the risk but maximize the odds of safely doing so by protective equipment.

Slappers happen due to poor road conditions, poor bike framework or geometry, or most likely, poor rider judgement and control. We cannot do anything about the first two, but we can all work on the nut holding the bars!

Good luck and safe riding!

Jungleboy · 07-10-2005, 8:15 PM

I know this is a controversial subject and a lot of people wont agree with what Im about to say, but I have raced motocross, speedway done trackdays on my RGV250 and 954RR and hopefully will enter a race before the year is out if everything goes to plan. Anyway my point for mentioning the above is to say that I have encountered headshake/tankslappers on literally hundreds of occausions and have always nipped them in the bud almost instantly, here is what I do when the situation occurs..

1) If conditions allow do not back off the throttle, hold constant or accellarate a little if possible.

2) While doing the above apply presure to the rear brake (do not stamp on it)

3) Now heres the controversial part.. against the general consensus I do not relax my grip on the bars! I have always used brute force to stop the bars wrenching from side to side almost instantly! ( maybe being a fit 210lbs @ 5'9" may have something to do with it? ) but Ive had a violent tank slapper at 90-100mph and the rider behind on a CBR600 said there was smoke coming of my front tyre!

I have never had any issues with not having enough strength to stop the bars from oscillating almost instantly (Im not going to be some rubber armed passenger hanging off the back letting the bike take me for a ride, Im in charge here! ) Anyway I know this will get a lot of people excited, but this is just what works for me and always has done

ps. In your argument take into consideration that before I herniated 2 discs in my lower back I was deadlifting 400lbs without the aid of straps, so I definately have a decent grip, although now I cringe when lifting 120lbs (oh well such is life

)

Hammer · 07-11-2005, 1:25 AM

PRAY!

RPinOZ · 07-11-2005, 1:51 AM

After a tankslapper you should squeeze the front brake a couple of times because the violent motion causes the brake pistons to retract into the calipers so you will have no front brakes until you squeeze them back to the disc.

To avoid a slapper between now and when you fit the damper, don't give it heaps of gas which will lighten the front and avoid bumpy roads.

JakeT · 07-11-2005, 3:32 AM

"I have always used brute force to stop the bars wrenching from side to side almost instantly! "

Actually steering damper works in the same way. The harder it is set, the more it prevents slappers.

not vice versa.

But usually the bike wants to stop the slapper. People correcting the steering can oskillate it more, because every corrective movement is late, it's already turning to the direction you already are correcting. If the driver drops off the bike usually calms down.

So I say let it slap. Pump the brakes after ,I had slapper after rear wheel slide straighted out little fast and the brakes where gone after that. It took couple of pumps before they worked again.

Steering damper is a life safer. I have heard 954 slapper that was so violent the drivers wrists broke.

allred · 07-11-2005, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thelemur

I have a steering damper on order, but in case the situation arises before then, id like to know what action i should take.

UPGRADE THE SHIPPING ON YOUR DAMPER TO "NEXT DAY AIR"!!!!!!

luvtolean · 07-11-2005, 1:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jungleboy

I know this is a controversial subject and a lot of people wont agree with what Im about to say, but I have raced motocross, speedway done trackdays on my RGV250 and 954RR and hopefully will enter a race before the year is out if everything goes to plan. Anyway my point for mentioning the above is to say that I have encountered headshake/tankslappers on literally hundreds of occausions and have always nipped them in the bud almost instantly, here is what I do when the situation occurs..

1) If conditions allow do not back off the throttle, hold constant or accellarate a little if possible.

2) While doing the above apply presure to the rear brake (do not stamp on it)

3) Now heres the controversial part.. against the general consensus I do not relax my grip on the bars! I have always used brute force to stop the bars wrenching from side to side almost instantly! ( maybe being a fit 210lbs @ 5'9" may have something to do with it? ) but Ive had a violent tank slapper at 90-100mph and the rider behind on a CBR600 said there was smoke coming of my front tyre!

I have never had any issues with not having enough strength to stop the bars from oscillating almost instantly (Im not going to be some rubber armed passenger hanging off the back letting the bike take me for a ride, Im in charge here! ) Anyway I know this will get a lot of people excited, but this is just what works for me and always has done

ps. In your argument take into consideration that before I herniated 2 discs in my lower back I was deadlifting 400lbs without the aid of straps, so I definately have a decent grip, although now I cringe when lifting 120lbs (oh well such is life

)

Deadlifting 400, nice. Might explain a bit. I just did my reps with a bit less than half that.

Anyways, on my dirtbike, I ALWAYS do fight it. A dirtbike is a very different animal, you're going slower, and there is less inertia in the wheels and engine trying to keep it upright.

I've never had anything more than headshake on the street. (Note, non-racer friends call stuff "tankslappers" that I don't even register as headshake, so everyone's definition is different) But on the track, I've had some wicked tankslappers. I've found squeezing with my knees and relaxing my grip to let the bike regain its composure a bit before I start fighting it to be the best way to deal with it.

Maybe in my next racing career I'll be strong enough to fight it into submission from the get go.

SpikedLemon · 07-17-2005, 1:33 PM

I used to always fight it and get off the throttle (in hopes that the front tire will settle straight)... I've also stopped it by hitting the throttle hard and getting the front tire off the ground as well.
I've since got a damper and I've only had a little headshake that was dampened out after a few wiggles.

Stealth · 08-11-2005, 7:58 AM

Won't fighting it just transfer the 'slapping' into the whole bike - which is worse?

KJ's RR · 08-11-2005, 8:26 AM

[I suppose the passion we all have drives us to do this sport regardless... Much like jumping out of an aircraft wearing a parachute when knowing all along that the aircraft will safely land when the jumpers might not. We take the risk but maximize the odds of safely doing so by protective equipment.

Have you ever been up in a jump plane? Those things are usually about 1 takeoff away from break'n up. The piolt's are the Crazy ones cause they keep taking it up & down !!

jonno954 · 08-11-2005, 9:42 AM

Hold the throttle wide open and love it like you love your girlfriends younger sister.

Machinist · 08-11-2005, 1:47 PM

GET a STEERING DAMPNER

TheTruth21 · 08-11-2005, 1:58 PM

I just had my first tankslapper a few days ago going around 90mph. I know it scared the **** out of me. I locked my arms held a constant throttle and prayed to every God imaginable.

int76 · 08-13-2005, 5:46 PM

what i have found to work for me is out a death grip on it and rip on the throttle, lightens the front end and pulls right out of it. have went into a tankslapper on 3 different occasions on my everyday bike, have a scotts on my other blade and love it. hopefully i can get one for my commuter

hookedon2wheels · 03-04-2006, 4:13 PM

Here is a short instructional vidoe link taught by one of the greats.

hookedon2wheels · 03-04-2006, 4:13 PM

Sorry here it is http://videos.streetfire.net/search/...C58B94D877.htm

CBRBob · 03-05-2006, 4:57 PM

Someone told me Code said to let go of the handlebars. Yea ok. Well when it happened to me I did just that and viola, no more tankslapper. Don't fight it, it will make it worse. If you have little trackion such as on dirt, you can fight it.

clutchslip · 03-05-2006, 7:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hammer

PRAY!

Every time I see that video it scars me. I have done that, but not that fast. Thanks motorcycle god for steering dampers.

luvtolean · 03-05-2006, 9:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by clutchslip

Every time I see that video it scars me. I have done that, but not that fast. Thanks motorcycle god for steering dampers.

It should, I'm pretty sure that rider died. And he probably did have a damper.

pirate929 · 03-20-2006, 12:18 PM

I having a little trouble comprehending why tankslappers occur. I mean physically what happens to make it wiggle like that. After watching the video it seems so random. I've been riding on my 929 for 2,500 miles without a damper, and I've yet to feel a headshake. I'm really not looking forward to it.

So why does it happen? Is when on of the wheels slides away from it's direct motion so they wiggle like that to straighten out again? Like some sort of a retarded highside motion?

HRC NICK 11 · 03-20-2006, 1:27 PM

I've had some huge slappers on the street and track, lucky for me I have always had room to ride them out.

Largest one ever was most of the front straight at Grattan, I got a double thumbs up from the flag guy the next lap, his eyes were about as large as mine as I went past the flag stand during the slapper.

But to be honest I don't know how to make them stop. I have had them stop my rolling of the gas and also had them stop by getting on the gas. I'm guessing if there was one easy answer we would do that instead of buying steering dampers.

I do know that if you touch the front brake it will be over real quick but you'll have a whole new set of problems. So don't ever touch the front brake during a slapper.

Zed · 03-20-2006, 6:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BDA116

Absolutely, positively never fight it. That is the worst thing you could do. All that will accomplish is a ride to the hospital.

Hmm the 3 or so near tankslappers (bad headshake?) that i have had on my Blade i fought it and thought immediately afterwards that if i had relaxed any it would have got worse or lost control?

I suppose if it developed into a bad tankslapper like in the attachment earlier in this thread, i'd be silly to try and control it with brute force strength.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BDA116

It can be very difficult to make yourself do, as it goes against many instincts and is hard to real world train yourself for.

I just bought & fitted a damper yesterday so hopefully i won't be getting any more bad headshake!

CBR929RE · 03-20-2006, 6:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pirate929

I having a little trouble comprehending why tankslappers occur. I mean physically what happens to make it wiggle like that. After watching the video it seems so random. I've been riding on my 929 for 2,500 miles without a damper, and I've yet to feel a headshake. I'm really not looking forward to it.

So why does it happen? Is when on of the wheels slides away from it's direct motion so they wiggle like that to straighten out again? Like some sort of a retarded highside motion?

I put 14k miles on my first 929 without the slightest hint of headshake. Today I rode my new 929 home and around for a little bit. This time its at stock height rather than slightly lowered and I can tell you the steering definetly feels lighter. Either way I wanted a damper on the last bike and I want one on this bike.

Smitty · 03-20-2006, 10:40 PM

Obviously you chaps are far, far faster then I am for once a tankslapper starts for me it is instantly a snap or two to the left or right & that is before I can even ease off the throttle. Then all goes wild & within a few seconds the bike has kicked me off.

That goes way back to my first on in flat tracking in '48 when I hit for the rough stuff higher up, to get by three chaps blocking me. Obviously not the first for it happened in Scrambling, Cross Country, Enduro, & Road Racing. Never in Observed Trials thankfully. Also never when on the hwys going at any speed I so choose.

Mind you when I purchased my 929 & realized immediately a steering head stabalizer was in need so rode with care till the Scotts appeared. Purchasing a 954 a few yrs later I also ordered a GBR.

veefer800canuck · 03-20-2006, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jungleboy

2) .........apply presure to the rear brake (do not stamp on it)

This worked for me in the past, it's kinda like applying the trailer brakes alone when the trailer is swaying.

Calms it right down.