What has been your experience with damper/stabilizer on your 929 or 954?

curt248 · 07-17-2008, 6:17 PM

I ordered a ohlins stabilizer for my 929 and am just curious what others experiences have been using a damper.

What differences did you notice if any? I'm sure it will help with tank slappers (only reason I considered ever getting one), but I've heard that they can make differences in handling as well.

clockworkorange · 07-17-2008, 6:52 PM

ive had a few really bad slappers on a 929 so if it makes any difference the its only a good thing

Dave213 · 07-17-2008, 8:38 PM

The difference you notice really comes down to how much you wind up the damping controls. I keep mine pretty tight so i feel a huge difference. A damper is a must on the 954/929

DUX · 07-17-2008, 8:45 PM

I liked my Scott's damper on the 954. It made the bike feel more stable/planted on the street.

curt248 · 07-17-2008, 9:01 PM

Dave. What is the difference you feel when your settings are cranked up?

Does it feel the same as stock when the settings are softer?

HondaGalToo · 07-17-2008, 9:32 PM

Unless you have it really cranked up, you won't even know it's there...until you need it. The bike just feels more stable up front, not as "shaky". You shouldn't have it cranked up so high that the bars are harder to turn, that's just askin' for a low speed tipover.

curt248 · 07-17-2008, 10:38 PM

Does it give you the confidence for WOT (wide open throttle) on almost any surface? On WOT on a bumpy road I noticed a bit of headshake. Nothing major but maybe an inch or two shifting from second to third and to fourth. The bike has so much power after my mods that it comes up even in full tuck in those gears.

I took my bike to an inexperienced tuner (against your advice) and lost about 20HP with his map. He didn't know about blocking the pair valve and even put 954 base maps in my 929 (I have a 954 powercommander).

He had a max HP of 123 on my bike. I was a bit dissappointed with the low number. On the way home I noticed that at WOT at about 70mph in 6th gear it had almost no acceleration. Normally it will take off like a mad dog at that speed in top gear.

I went home and put my original map back in and phew, the power was there again.

bettingpython · 07-18-2008, 10:48 AM

Wouldn't ride my 954 without it.

curt248 · 07-18-2008, 12:48 PM

I know lots of you wouldn't ride a 954/929 without one, but I'm interested in what changed after putting a damper on versus having no damper.

x[corwyn] · 07-18-2008, 3:43 PM

I gotta ask...what is it you guys are seeing or doing to create a tank slapper? I have an ohlins rear, PPS rebuilt forks, raised rear end, and Im riding very hard. I have only had one near tank slapper and that was from a quick shift into 2nd on a freeway where the wheel came up and down quickly but no big deal. I just replaced my steering bearings with new ones, and I make sure its adjusted correctly. Im sure a steering damper is nice, but with everything setup correcty right now I just havent had anything come close to the issues you guys have had. So what is it I am missing?

curt248 · 07-18-2008, 5:27 PM

I had never had a problem for over 10,000 miles either. After doing multiple mods to make the bike quicker, I lifted the front on purpose by pulling up on the bars (don't do that normally) and the set the front down over a really bumpy section of road at about 90mph. The handlebars went back and forth so fast at what seemed to be at or close to the steering stops. It was 100% rider input (error) that made this happen. Since then, I've noticed the front moving a bit under heavy acceleration. I'm thinking I'm just a bump in the road away from getting a big headshake again. I don't pull on the bars though so maybe not. I guess I'm just looking for a margin of safety since going down at 90mph wouldn't be pretty and would cost much more than a damper.

The other thing with big headshake is that your not in control of the bike when it happens. If a car stopped in front of me or turned in front of me during the headshake, I would be forced to crash into them instead of avoiding the crash.

I've noticed that since my engine is more powerful with mods that the front is light more often. The front was rarely light when stock.

bettingpython · 07-18-2008, 6:43 PM

something as stupid as a bump in the road under hard acceleration can cause an uncontrolled oscillation of the front end. I keep the low speed damping turned to 0 on my GPR I can feel the initial bump and shake that could cause a tank slapper but the high speed damping circuit quashes the oscilation. I don't understand this pulling back on the bars thing. My bike is stock with the exception of a slipon which added 5hp and it's nothing to loft the front end under acceleration out of a turn in 1st gear. I'm no lightweight either at 185lbs

curt248 · 07-18-2008, 6:48 PM

Well first gear would easily lift the front when the bike was stock. I'm thinking first gear on any 600 should do the same. I meant lifting the front in second, third and fourth.

bettingpython · 07-18-2008, 6:49 PM

just an FYI it doesn't need to be a liter bike to have a tankslapper. the AMA and CMRA both mandate steering dampers on all bikes. I know of 3 people who have had a tank slapper at the track on 600's

Dave213 · 07-18-2008, 8:11 PM

On my Scotts, I turn the dial all the way clockwise to the stop, then 1 full-circle turn counter. This is for a brisk canyon ride. While I'm no expert, I think the easiest way to describe it is that it kinda takes the 'wildness' out of her when I'm in a high speed sweeper. She feels much more planted. Hell, I can take my hand off the bar and slide it on the ground at full lean. I would never do that without my damper. When I'm done, I give it 1 more counter clockwise turn to loosen up the steering a bit. Oh, and if your into this sort of thing, it makes for a much smoother and controlled stoppie as well!

Dave213 · 07-18-2008, 8:17 PM

Oh, and this isn't only for fast sweepers. When I see an unavoidable pothole, I instinctively do a very small wheelie over it. Like most beginners, I would close the throttle when I saw an unavoidable pothole. Guess what? Front fork compresses from engine braking, and them BAM! you hit the pothole with ZERO damping in the front. Ouch! Happens all the time. However, if you wheelie over it (not even a wheelie really, just give it power to float the front over the pothole) and it is 10000 X more smoother. Anyways, I did that instinctively and the front started getting kinda crazy (before I got the damper). Sorry so long.

curt248 · 07-18-2008, 8:48 PM

No the longer the better. It takes more than 10 words to describe a feeling or difference.

About a month ago I was riding my bike after a really good cleaning and I saw an unavoidable 1 foot wet spot in the road. It was like a little river. I was in 4th gear going about 35mph. I instinctively gave a little gas and leaned back (like on my motocross bike to get over a whoop or other obstacle). To my great suprise I was able to wheelie over it. I bet that's what you are talking about with the wheelie over the pothole.

sbs125 · 07-19-2008, 12:49 AM

I did 4 sessions on the track at Calabogie and realized I did not even have the damn thing turned on. I have 20 clicks on my Ohlins for my 954. Track I crank it to 20 clicks, (of course remember to turn it off coming into the pits,,,slow speed steering is altered and tricky), for the street I turn it 5 clicks. Hope this helps

bladeracer · 07-19-2008, 2:29 AM

Tankslappers are possible on any bike, even cruisers and dirtbikes.
CMRA does require dampers but AMA don't.

doogstar · 07-19-2008, 4:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by curt248

No the longer the better. It takes more than 10 words to describe a feeling or difference.

About a month ago I was riding my bike after a really good cleaning and I saw an unavoidable 1 foot wet spot in the road. It was like a little river. I was in 4th gear going about 35mph. I instinctively gave a little gas and leaned back (like on my motocross bike to get over a whoop or other obstacle). To my great suprise I was able to wheelie over it. I bet that's what you are talking about with the wheelie over the pothole.

Im calling Bull$hit on this one bro. A power wheelie in 4th gear going 35 mph? Im not buying it. I dont think its possible. Why would you be in 4th gear going 35 anyway?

bladeracer · 07-19-2008, 4:37 AM

I'm not sure he's talking about an actual wheelie but you should definately approach unavoidable objects and speedbumps with the forks as unloaded as possible. I hit speedbumps by braking very lightly and then letting off so the forks are unloading just at the moment of impact so they have to overcome their upward inertia before they can compress giving you an extra buffer.
I wouldn't have considered a one-foot wet spot to be anything to be worried about though...

curt248 · 07-19-2008, 10:50 AM

I know. Lifting the front over the water was done on instinct. Something about having a clean bike made me think of it as an emergency.

The front did lift a couple of inches for enough time to get over the water. I was just as suprised as you when it happened.

Much of my teenage years were spent riding a 1988 Yamaha Warrior ATV. Even though it had a 350cc (~21 HP) engine, the front was very hard to lift over obstacles. They moved the motor back to combat this in 1989 I believe.

If the technique is done just right, you can lift it and apparently the same works for our bikes as well. This is probably something like how some people can wheelie any bike and I have trouble getting my bike up more than 2 feet.

btw: this was not exactly a power wheelie. I guess it depends on your definition of power wheelie. If you are on your pedal bike going 5mph and just pull up on the bars to have the front wheel come off the ground a couple of inches and happen to be pushing on the pedal with a bit more force than required to maintain speed a power wheelie. Then I guess it would be a power wheelie. I consider a power wheelie when the front comes off the ground because the acceleration is so strong that the front can't stay down.

doogstar · 07-19-2008, 12:56 PM

I consider a power wheelie to be when your front end comes up from throttle only. no clutch

bladeracer · 07-19-2008, 1:08 PM

I consider a power wheelie to also not involve snapping the throttle open. Simply accelerate and at some point the bike starts lifting of its own accord - that's a power wheelie in my book.
My 929 powers up in 3rd currently as it pulls through 9500rpm even when I'm down on the tank unless I stay on top of it but I'm putting that down to not yet having mapped it to use the 954 throttle bodies optimally. Hopefully smoothing the curve should make it a little more civilised.

doogstar · 07-19-2008, 3:43 PM

I agree but, at 35 mph, in 4h gear, no bike will lift. rpms will be no way near 9500

curt248 · 07-19-2008, 3:48 PM

Yeah when I'm on it hard in a full tuck on the tank mine comes up a couple of inches in fourth as well.

I know some people consider it to be a power wheelie when they chop the throttle and power back on (no clutch involved). I wonder what that would be called though. It is a wheelie under power but with the use of the forks like a pogo stick.

I wonder if that's what I did instinctively to get the front to come up with virtually no power at 30mph in 4th to get over that little water stream. I probably pushed down on the bars and gased it up with the ideal timing to get it up a bit.

curt248 · 07-19-2008, 3:54 PM

Hey dogstar. Do you ever get people with those rented vipers and ferrari's to race to on your bike?

Which island do you live on? It must be hard to find new roads to explore out there.