Head gasket help

vernieman21 · 06-01-2007, 1:30 PM

Coolant is getting in my oil on my f4 so I'm assuming it is the head gasket. Any tips on this replacement would help a ton. thanks.

Tornado bait · 06-01-2007, 3:23 PM

Get a good repair manual. Worth the price for a project like this. I replaced the head on my 600RR and it helped a lot.

fshrmn76 · 06-01-2007, 10:56 PM

I had a friend with a similar problem. He replaced the head gasket and still had a leak. Turns out there was a leaking o-ring in the water pump and it was letting a bit of fluid by. Just a suggestion but maybe give it a check before you completely take it apart.

vernieman21 · 06-08-2007, 6:39 PM

thanks

vernieman21 · 06-08-2007, 9:15 PM

i took the water pump apart today and cant seem to understand how the O ring keeps the oil and antifreeze seperate. the ring looks fine to me. i posted pics from the manual.

theres two pics. do i replace the FIRST O ring, or the second? and what is the THRUST WASHER? if that is a removable washer or ring, i dont think its there on my bike.

http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g1...out3/oring.jpg

vernieman21 · 06-11-2007, 11:16 AM

anyone? anyone?

nedro · 06-11-2007, 12:56 PM

So basically there is an O ring behind the impeller that you cannot replace. If the backside of the shaft has some moisture on it, it's leaking. The two O rings you are looking at are not the one that leaks water to the crankcase.

A thrust washer prevents a shaft from walking in and out.

MADMAX_33 · 06-11-2007, 1:01 PM

Wonder can anyone help me on a similar situation, pressure keeps building up in the cooling system and blows the top of the expansion tank beneath the radiator and all the coolant sprays all over the side of the bike while im driving.I changed the thermostat thinking that might be the problem.Wondering is the head gasket taking are in air? Any ideas ?

Mark

nedro · 06-11-2007, 1:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MADMAX_33

Wonder can anyone help me on a similar situation, pressure keeps building up in the cooling system and blows the top of the expansion tank beneath the radiator and all the coolant sprays all over the side of the bike while im driving.I changed the thermostat thinking that might be the problem.Wondering is the head gasket taking are in air? Any ideas ?

Mark

Classic Head gasket symtom. If you have access to a sniffer (Gass analizer i.e. smog machine), take the rad cap off and put the sniffer up to the radiator fill neck with the engine running and at full temp. If the head gasket is the culprate, the HCs will clime.

vernieman21 · 06-14-2007, 12:14 PM

is there any other signs to say the head gasket is bad? my bike didnt exhaust any smoke at all, and didnt overheat, but the oil was VERY milky every after an oil change and only running it for a minute. the water pump and thermostat were CLOGGED badly with oil, which makes me think the water pump did have a leak, but i dont want to replace them both and put everything back together...just to find out that the head gasket is def bad. i have everything apart now, soon to take the head off. should i just do it? or is there any way i can be for sure i need a new gasket?

nedro · 06-14-2007, 9:58 PM

This one had me turned around for a while. First you said that the water is inthe oil. That's pretty easy. Then you say that it also has oil in the waterjackets, infact you say it has a clogged water pump. That's what threw me sidesways. So I took a look at your engine config and guess what? I do believe that what your are experiencing is a broken/bad oil cooler. I can't figure out any other way for oil to get into the water AND visa versa. It's usually one or the other because it's usually a pressure differential that drives one or the other fluid into the wrong area. The oil cooler is what your oil filter screws onto. No mystery taking it off. Just unscrew the oil filter, take the water hoses off the cooler and (I believe) unscrew the oil filter threads by turning the base nut and the cooler should come off. Check it out.

Tip: When diagnosing something like this, LOOK AT EVERYTHING YOU TAKE OFF. Try not letting oily much get all over the place and/or on parts you haven't inspected yet. That way you're not confusing spillover with actuall goo coming from the part you are working on.
Also take a look at the water hoses when you remove them from the cooler.
You will have to ultimately diagnos if that is the part that's causing al of this since I have no way of looking at it myself.

CinCBR1 · 06-15-2007, 4:14 AM

Oil cooler would be a good shot too. but it can still be on the head gasket side as well, your oil pressure is always higher then water pressure(99% of the time);with it higher would force oil into the cooling side, except on the drainage side where there is no pressure. you dont have to have white smoke to have a blown head gasket, white smoke just means its blown to a cyclinder, you can have it blown between a water jacket and a presure side oil passage. working alot with bus engines and HMMWV engines, when a cooler goes it generaly has the same characteristics(spl chk) as what your discribing. Specially if you already replaced your water pump o-rings if they do infact seal from a route in which pressurized oil goes. As for the water geting back into the oiling system when u shut the bike off water pressure still exists due to temp. and that will force water back into the oil side cause your oil pressure is no longer there. Gluck with this. i agree with nedro, troubleshooting the cooler will help alot in narrowing it down.

vernieman21 · 06-15-2007, 2:39 PM

remember though, i drained the murky looking oil from the bike and put fresh oil in it. i cranked it a couple times..not sure if it even started up, and IMMEDIATELY realized the oil was full of water again. i dont even think it had a chance to get into the head gasket before i shut it off and took it apart again. unless the head is cracked, i dont think it would mix that fast with a blown head gasket.

*sinfuldragon* · 06-15-2007, 3:45 PM

well then it looks like you are at a crossroads in life. Replace the oil cooler and chance that not being it. However much money wasted not a lot of time. or waste a lot of time taking off the head, cleaning off the gasket and replacing that. not a lot of money wasted but a lot of time... choices choices... I would go with Nedro's suggestion

CinCBR1 · 06-16-2007, 4:33 AM

What u could do to troubleshoot is to cap off your oil cooler from the system and get a pressure tester and presurize your cooling system with the oil plug off the the bike, if it is truely in the head or block or what ever it will at least it will eliminate the cooler. Make sure you only presurize it the cap/system pressure. this will tell you if its something in the block. you will notice water coming out the bottem of the bike. Gluck with this step.

vernieman21 · 07-12-2007, 4:36 PM

wow, looking at the thread date..its been a month and it still doesnt run. i took the head apart and the gasket looked brand new. the head also looked in good shape. put it back on and it still mixed, oil and coolant. i pour antifreeze, and it runs straight through to the oil drain plug. it doesnt make sense that even the block is cracked because the bike didnt smoke or run rough prior to this problem.

nedro · 07-12-2007, 5:01 PM

Pull the water pump from the engine. Block off the hoses going to the pump and check if you still have water going into your crankcase. Or you can pull the waterpump, reconnect the hoses to the pump (if there is enough room) and try to fill the cooling system. If water comes out the back of the pump, you found it.

dattaway · 07-12-2007, 5:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MADMAX_33

Wonder can anyone help me on a similar situation, pressure keeps building up in the cooling system and blows the top of the expansion tank beneath the radiator and all the coolant sprays all over the side of the bike while im driving.I changed the thermostat thinking that might be the problem.Wondering is the head gasket taking are in air? Any ideas ?

Mark

How many miles? If above 40,000, its likely the rubber disc on the cap will be worn from heat expansion cycles. All it takes is a little feathering on the rubber and it won't seal. Take the rubber disc off the cap, flip it over, and see if it still leaks.