[moregrip]

So I went for a ride today with my bro who rides a Ducati 999R Xerox and I realized just how lacking my stock suspension really is. In an effort to convince the wife that an upgraded suspension has value and is necessary at this point I need to be able to explain what happened to me today to justify the $$ to change the setup, let me explain what happened.

We were riding at a quick pace but nothing I would consider obscene through a typical local SoCal canyon. At first I just figured I'd just follow my buddies lines through the canyon/turns but quickly realized that was not going to work for me, meaning while his bike was rock solid steady I was literally being bounced about with the rear end stepping out on me a few times. This was definitely not going to be the fun ride I thought it would because I had to be especially careful with the lines I chose. And while my 954 never did anything sooo terrible that I **** a brick, my confidence in the bike certainly wasn't there either.

To be perfectly honest, the suspension just felt worn out; but that seems ridiculous as I only have 5k on her so that couldn't be the case. Also there was one turn, long sweeper, slightly banked, where the front end felt like it wouldn't rebound and kept falling into the turn, despite more throttle, so I ended up having to jerk it up while pressing down on my outer foot peg.

So what do I need?
I know what I want, that same solid stability as my bros Ducati, in fact, he said he couldn't even feel what it was I was experiencing.

Anyway to get this done without spending a mint? Thanks

[CBR929RE]

I am by far no expert at suspensions but first thing I'd suggest is to ride it in a different way (after you have the sag set up properly). You can't ride a 954 like a 999r. they both like different lines through a turn.

[gt702]

My RC51, which was early in the production run, had a terrible suspension stock. It would literally pitch me out of the seat on minor bumps ... I'm talking expansion joint even. The front wasn't much better, and there was no way I would ride hard in bumpy conditions. I had Dan Kyle do the forks and put an Ohlins out back. That completely changed the bike. No more worries of bumps. It is always composed and in most cases feels almost plush, in a controlled manner.

If you are riding 2 up that way, she would definitely be more comfortable with a good suspension under you. Stock is set up for someone around 150 lbs. and is definitely under damped (that worn out feeling) and under sprung (in the wrong part of the travel) for much 2 up riding.

Hope that helps your cause.

[HondaGalToo]

Yup, agree with gt702. Have Dan Kyle revalve and respring your stock forks. That'll be about $450. Then get an Ohlins out back. That'll transform your bike. The Honda comes with front springs that are way too soft unless you're under 140 pounds, and a rear shock that's too stiff. It's set up like you're going to always carry a passenger. Then get a basic suspension set up by someone knowlegeable. Get the sag set properly.

[moregrip]

so the Dan Kyle front fork/Ohlins rear shock is really THAT noticeable?

[gt702]

Originally Posted by moregrip

so the Dan Kyle front fork/Ohlins rear shock is really THAT noticeable?

I can't talk to the CBR, but on my RC51 (which might have been worse than most ... or maybe it is just our bad roads) it was night and day. The RC was almost unrideable on anything but the smoothest roads. Now I blast down the worst of them with confidence and a lot less fatigue and jarring.

I've had Ohlins on all of my VFR's also, and it drastically changes the ride for the better on that bike too. There are other good shocks that may cost less, but I always like the remote preload adjuster on the Ohlins, especially on the VFR where I might carry passengers and luggage. If you don't need the remote preload (makes it easy to change for passenger comfort and to keep the geometry correct) then there are other options that would be less costly.

[moregrip]

Originally Posted by CBR929RE

I am by far no expert at suspensions but first thing I'd suggest is to ride it in a different way (after you have the sag set up properly). You can't ride a 954 like a 999r. they both like different lines through a turn.

I hear ya bro, but shoot, we weren't going THAT fast, in my mind I should be able to follow his lines at those speeds no problem.

I mean it was night and day out there

[CBR929RE]

Originally Posted by moregrip

I hear ya bro, but shoot, we weren't going THAT fast, in my mind I should be able to follow his lines at those speeds no problem.

I mean it was night and day out there

so then you're probably at the point where you need the suspension work others have suggested.

also remember his Duc has full ohlins front and rear, doesn't it? really helps to have the good stuff.

[moregrip]

Originally Posted by CBR929RE

so then you're probably at the point where you need the suspension work others have suggested.

also remember his Duc has full ohlins front and rear, doesn't it? really helps to have the good stuff.

yeah, he had ohlins front and rear and steering damper(I don't even have one of those), AMAZING what a difference it made

[moregrip]

Originally Posted by gt702

I can't talk to the CBR, but on my RC51 (which might have been worse than most ... or maybe it is just our bad roads) it was night and day. The RC was almost unrideable on anything but the smoothest roads. Now I blast down the worst of them with confidence and a lot less fatigue and jarring.

I've had Ohlins on all of my VFR's also, and it drastically changes the ride for the better on that bike too. There are other good shocks that may cost less, but I always like the remote preload adjuster on the Ohlins, especially on the VFR where I might carry passengers and luggage. If you don't need the remote preload (makes it easy to change for passenger comfort and to keep the geometry correct) then there are other options that would be less costly.

I never ride any passengers so I wouldn't have that problem. Was the Dan Kyle front fork night and day as well as the ohlins?

Back in the early 90's I used to run a WP shock on my Ninja 750 and it seemed to be solid as well.
I

[Cam954]

Here is my 2 cents.

There aren't many of us that can actually push the stock suspension to it's limits. Especially not on the street. The stock suspension is pretty good and you should be able to adjust it to work really well for you unless you are carring a little extra weight on you.

It is possible that your friend has a little more experience than you or has his suspension setup a little better for himself.

[moregrip]

Originally Posted by Cam954

Here is my 2 cents.

There aren't many of us that can actually push the stock suspension to it's limits. Especially not on the street. The stock suspension is pretty good and you should be able to adjust it to work really well for you unless you are carring a little extra weight on you.

It is possible that your friend has a little more experience than you or has his suspension setup a little better for himself.

I weigh 225lbs. I think we are at equal riding levels.

[DUX]

Originally Posted by moregrip

yeah, he had ohlins front and rear and steering damper(I don't even have one of those), AMAZING what a difference it made

A steering damper (mine was a Scotts) made my 954 feel like a completely different bike.

[monkey]

Originally Posted by moregrip

I weigh 225lbs. I think we are at equal riding levels.

225 screams for suspension work. stock springs in my 954 were .74's, good for a 150lb rider.

you mention the rear being harsh. sounds like too much rebound damping to me. find out what ALL your stock baseline settings are and work from there. be sure to write EVERYTHING down. move a half turn at a time and ride a familiar road and notice how it feels.

you mentioned the front end tipping in. have the forks been moved up in the triple clamps? are you running the same tires front and rear? what kind of tires? some have a more triangulated profile to help with turn-in. is the rear ride height adjustable? has it been raised?

sportrider.com has a link to suggested suspension settings for a variety of models of bikes. these are a pretty good starting point.

Good luck!

[moregrip]

Originally Posted by monkey

225 screams for suspension work. stock springs in my 954 were .74's, good for a 150lb rider.

you mention the rear being harsh. sounds like too much rebound damping to me. find out what ALL your stock baseline settings are and work from there. be sure to write EVERYTHING down. move a half turn at a time and ride a familiar road and notice how it feels.

you mentioned the front end tipping in. have the forks been moved up in the triple clamps? are you running the same tires front and rear? what kind of tires? some have a more triangulated profile to help with turn-in. is the rear ride height adjustable? has it been raised?

sportrider.com has a link to suggested suspension settings for a variety of models of bikes. these are a pretty good starting point.

Good luck!

Tires = Michilen Pilot Powers, matching set 37psi f/r
Suspension = stock = never touched
Forks = stock position in triple clamps

[Scout]

First, take your bike to your local trusted mechanic. Have him set the static sag for you. You have to be there to help.

If he's familiar with 954's, he'll know he won't get the recommended static sag for the forks, it's impossible with the type of stock springs at 225.

Have him do front and back.

Do this right away, before you learn the hard way, like I did - riding too hard on a steep declining reducing radius turn when the forks bottomed = ouch to the body, ego, and wallet.

I'm still on stock for the street, with more miles on the bike than yours - it will help.

Also, a well ridden 954 can keep up with just about anything, but ride your own ride, and good luck.

[moregrip]

Originally Posted by Scout

First, take your bike to your local trusted mechanic. Have him set the static sag for you. You have to be there to help.

If he's familiar with 954's, he'll know he won't get the recommended static sag for the forks, it's impossible with the type of stock springs at 225.

Have him do front and back.

Do this right away, before you learn the hard way, like I did - riding too hard on a steep declining reducing radius turn when the forks bottomed = ouch to the body, ego, and wallet.

I'm still on stock for the street, with more miles on the bike than yours - it will help.

Also, a well ridden 954 can keep up with just about anything, but ride your own ride, and good luck.

if I only I had a trusted mechanic , I have always done most-all of my own work mechanically.

can I set static sag using swingarm/fork stands?

[Scout]

Originally Posted by moregrip

if I only I had a trusted mechanic , I have always done most-all of my own work mechanically.

can I set static sag using swingarm/fork stands?

No, because:

A: Measurements are taken with the bike loaded (as well as bike unloaded), and that means you sitting on it. You're not going to webcrawl spidey-like all over your bike taking measurements (though it would be funny to watch ).

B: Some fork stands unload the suspension in front.


as an addendum, once you find someone to assist you, I don't remember ideal sag measurements but it's the neighborhood of 25-35mm (check that sportrider link, or google "static sag motorcycle"). You'll have something like 40mm on full preload up front. DON'T PANIC! I have the forks at max preload, and with a little damping adjustment they are just fine. I'm about 250.

You can do this yourself (with a friend of course), I just recommend a good suspension guy, so your settings don't get fubar'd.

[ihatecrashing]

The book "Total Control" has some great info on setting up suspension. You'll need somebody else there with you to set the sag because you will have to be sitting on the bike just about the whole time.

[sheepofblue]

Originally Posted by Scout

No, because:

A: Measurements are taken with the bike loaded (as well as bike unloaded), and that means you sitting on it. You're not going to webcrawl spidey-like all over your bike taking measurements (though it would be funny to watch ).

B: Some fork stands unload the suspension in front.


as an addendum, once you find someone to assist you, I don't remember ideal sag measurements but it's the neighborhood of 25-35mm (check that sportrider link, or google "static sag motorcycle"). You'll have something like 40mm on full preload up front. DON'T PANIC! I have the forks at max preload, and with a little damping adjustment they are just fine. I'm about 250.

You can do this yourself (with a friend of course), I just recommend a good suspension guy, so your settings don't get fubar'd.

I understand where you are coming from on the fubar but I have had good input from folks a lot smarter than me. Write the settings down then change things it is ADJUSTABLE suspension. One suggestion was to get sag set then with everything stock set the rebound to max, then min to feel what it will do, repeat with compression. It made sense to me in a weird kind of way. If you write your settings down you can always get back to them pretty fast

[moregrip]

Originally Posted by ihatecrashing

The book "Total Control" has some great info on setting up suspension. You'll need somebody else there with you to set the sag because you will have to be sitting on the bike just about the whole time.

Hey, I have that book

I better go dig it out of the garage now

[SuperDave]

Originally Posted by DUX

A steering damper (mine was a Scotts) made my 954 feel like a completely different bike.

]

[clutchslip]

Originally Posted by CBR929RE

......
also remember his Duc has full ohlins front and rear, doesn't it? really helps to have the good stuff.

First:
The other guy was on a 999R - RRRRRR.
I mean, hey, we are REALLY talking track ready with that Duc.
Ducs handle really nice and smooth. If you can, ride his and be enlightened.

Second: (as mentioned)
Your weight screams for different springs.

Third:
I can set my sag by myself.