[splatty]

Originally Posted by kthrockm

If you had your oil changed at 600 and only went an additional 200 since then you would probably not notice any excess oil usage yet. Keep watching it - I didn't notice it until 1500 miles, which would be about 900 miles after my first change. My uneducated belief is that the conventional oil would burn more quickly than an ester based full synthetic, so I don't think using a conventional or partial synthetic oil would explain no apparent oil usage. Could be how you ride too - if you are taking it easy during a break in period you would probably not be revving it like you would after the engine is broken in. I followed Honda's advice on break in carefully and didn't ride it hard until after I had several hundred miles on it. Then again maybe you just got lucky and I didn't! I still love the bike. Something about doing a power wheelie at 90mph without even trying that sends shivers up and down my spine. But I'm gonna keep an eye on the oil usage!

I'm sure you are absolutely right mate regarding the low mileage. TBH, anybody who reads my posts will know I am a spanner idiot, and not the best at checking oil/chain play etc.

However, Hoody has now made me mildly paranoid and I check it regularly. I am going to check it in the morning, do a 100 mile semi-hard run, and check it when I get back. I am not expecting it to change in that period, I am just trying to get myself in the habit of doing it.

On the plus side for Hoody, good on Honda for changing it. Like I said, my dealer says they only ever use semi-synth oil in the bikes they service. Wonder if this has any relevance. I will probably stop in there tomorrow for a cuppa, I'll have a chat to their techs and get their input. I will also pick up a litre top up bottle for home !!

[D.Nac]

Originally Posted by Sheland

Correct fuel mixture - The manufacturer already tuned your engine optimally. We do not have to do anything there.
Gradual Progression of RPM - Carefully increase the throttle.
Varying speed - always change the speed (RPM). Constant speed or RPM may cause 'glazing'.
Correct oil - your dealer would have used proper oil. For motorcycles, synthetic oil is not recommended for the first 600 miles.

Complete piston ring seating will happen in 15 - 20 hours of engine operation.

How does the motoman break-in differ from what you stated above?

The Motoman break-in appears the same as what your engineer friend said.

The factory break-in of limiting the max rpm to a specific low number does not match what your engineer friend stated above.

If the engine will not pull higher RPMs when new, what makes you think it will do it when its older?

P.S. The factory redlines the engine during final testing and has for years.

[Slippy]

My dealer is now onto Honda UK they're happy that my consumption is way too high see we'll see what comes of it next week.

[ghbzorro]

Originally Posted by Sheland

Please follow the manufacturer's recommendation.

Please educate yourself and them please make your own decision.

I keep reading of complaints about high oil consumption and the owners always claim to have followed the manufacturer's recommendations religiously.

Your point about the oil intrigues me. Does Honda empty the factory oil before shipping and then have the dealer put oil into the bike?? I wonder whether this rash of failures has been caused by dealers filling with synthetic oil when it should have been non-synthetic.

[Sheland]

Originally Posted by ghbzorro

Please educate yourself and them please make your own decision.

I keep reading of complaints about high oil consumption and the owners always claim to have followed the manufacturer's recommendations religiously.

Your point about the oil intrigues me. Does Honda empty the factory oil before shipping and then have the dealer put oil into the bike?? I wonder whether this rash of failures has been caused by dealers filling with synthetic oil when it should have been non-synthetic.

I understand that even if we follow manufacturer's reccomendation, things could go wrong. I would not want anyone to lose warranty by following some process that may harm the vehicle.

Regarding the oil, the dealer is supposed drain the existing oil (factory oil) and fill the engine with recommended oil. When I bought my 600 last year, my dealer mistakenly filled it with a non-Honda branded oil. The dealer called me back next day and send the head mechanic to my home to replace the oil.

[Zuhnu99]

Now my Fireblade have 3100 miles in the odo meter. I was used in first 600 mile oil change full synthetic Motul 7100 10W-40 oil. Oil level is lowered 1/3.th between of the dip stick marks. That is normal in motor which has driven so little.

Break in is driven carefully. No high revs in the early miles and I was used changing rpm's.

[Slippy]

The latest from my dealer is that Honda have told them to change the oil and filter and set the level on their fixed frame, I'm to leave well alone and go back after 500 miles and they'll check it again to see what it's using.

They're talking about engine work but I'm not convinced that's good enough on a brand new bike so we'll see

[bob bobbleton]

Interesting............

I have a two week old blade with 1850 miles on it :-)

Had it serviced at 585 miles, ran it in really gently never went over 7k rpm

Since then, I have added 1 litre of oil (£10.50)
It still isnt at the maximum mark.

The exhaust is "sooty"
There are no signs of smoke when running, obviously there are no leaks.

Ive never had a bike that uses so much oil, so will go and talk to my dealer on Monday after work.

At this rate, it will consume 4 litres of oil between every 4k service which seems too much.

However, since getting the bike, Ive been to the nurburgring, done 29 laps there, and done a trackday at croft yesterday.

Will update when ive been to the dealers.

Cheers

Bobby

[Slippy]

Since Scotland I've done two decent rideouts and 500 miles... I had to put in nearly another half litre.

Went out this morning and 200 miles later it's half way down the stick again.

Oh and my can is well sooty.

The dealer old me whatever you do after they've filled it don't top it up if the engine seizes that's Honda's problem, that's great as long as I'm not riding it, in which case it's my problem.

It's in for an oil change on the 16th July when it's also getting it's 4k service.... so we'll see from then on.

I love the bike and the engine is fine apart for the oil fiasco partially offset by it's amazing fuel economy which hacks off my mates ... frustrating

[gxtoast]

Originally Posted by Slippy

...The dealer old me whatever you do after they've filled it don't top it up if the engine seizes that's Honda's problem...

That's fine for them to assume that it's gonna seize and that you are going to get a new bike. But, what happens if it doesn't seize, and the lack of oil radically reduces engine life and possibly causes complications later on?

You might end up with an undesireable situation. I would talk to the dealer about this possible scenario and ask how they will mitigate the likelyhood of you being left with an undesireable problem.

Good luck

[Hoody]

Honda say that the new Fireblade can use up to 1L of oil per 1000 miles, they also say that you must check your oil before every ride! So if you do not check the oil and it seizes, they would know if was oil starvation. In other words 'you' did not check your oil

I had to take my 60 mile replacement 2008 Fireblade back, because it had too much oil in it So while I was there I was introduced to the Head of Technical Honda UK by someone who I don't think knew why I was there So we had a chat about the Fireblade etc, then the mechanic came out and told me there was 100ml of oil too much in there. So head on Tech Honda asked me what he was on about. So obviously I told him, I don't think he was too impressed as this was the replacement bike with only 60 miles on the clock. He also commented on how too much oil is worse that too little, I knew this, hence why I was still huffing and puffing

So if you think it is using too much oil, get back to the supplier, get the oil monitored so Honda know exactly what it is using. Then facts are facts



.............. Hoody

[splatty]

This is starting to sound serious boys

[Hoody]

I hope my replacement does not use oil like the other, I do not fancy going through it all again.


............... Hoody

[Slippy]

Originally Posted by Hoody

I hope my replacement does not use oil like the other, I do not fancy going through it all again.


............... Hoody

Out of curiosity just how much was it using??

[bob bobbleton]

Latest update on my 1 litre consumption in 1200 miles.

This isnt abnormal, it is only abnormal if it exceeds 1 litre per 1000 miles, however Honda are recommending that the dealer, free of charge replace the oil with Semi synthetic for the next 2000 miles, record consumption, and then revert back to the recommended castrol power 1 racing 10W30 fully synthetic oil.

Honda dealer says the motor hasnt bedded in properly. I commented that I have done 29 Nurburgring laps, and 125 miles round Croft circuit within those 1200 miles from Service, but they still think semi synthetic is the way forward for now.

For info, for the 1st 100 miles, I revved the bike to 6k rpm on light loads
For miles 100 to 585, i used 7 to 8k rpm.
Once I had the service done, I built the revs up gently in one 90 mile ride to use full rev range. Bike fully thrashed at 650 miles, upto 150 ish on roads.

Hit 180 mph every lap on nurburgring last straight as well, so other than its 100 mph motorway miles, it hasnt had an easy life !!
Not yet bedded in mmmmmmmmmmm Wonder if Valentino Rossi is free to give it more abuse !!!!

Perhaps it may have been different if I had caned it from mile number 1........

Bobby B.

PS I think I will email MCN on this one, as I think Honda is hiding something, as there seems to be differing responses from all of the cases listed here and at 100rr.net, so perhaps we are conducting Honda's field testing

[bob bobbleton]

have been to the dealers for a free oil change where they have changed the oil to Castrol 10W30 semi synthetic.

Quick update. mileage on the semi synthetic oil 517 (2905 in total on the bike)
The oil level is still showing as the maximum mark on the dipstick.

The exhaust has cleaned up as well, only a couple of black spots show now. Its still sooty if you run your finger inside it though.

However, the difference in oil consumption is staggering, wonder whether the recommended castrol oil is really suited to the bike.....

Bobby B

[splatty]

Glad things are improving Bob.

You have got the exact same oil in your bike that is in mine now.

As I have said before, my dealer Sutton Motorcycles, told me that they only ever put semi-synth in all of the bikes that they service.

My Blade is still pretty low mileage (1200) but has used no oil whatsoever since I have had it. I ran it in as per the dealer recommendation of varied speeds/gears below 6k for 600 miles, then cane it

[gxtoast]

Originally Posted by splatty

I ran it in as per the dealer recommendation of varied speeds/gears below 6k for 600 miles, then cane it

Did you ask them about loading up the rings to fit them to the cyclinder properly during run-in? Everyone is talking about this and in australia most mechanics recommend a procedural run-in that loads up the rings. If this isn't done quickly, the rings won't fit snugly and blowby continues through the life of the engine.

This is what I keep hearing time and again. Apparently babying these bikes is one of the less desireable things to do during run-in. On the other hand, too much loading of the engine can shorten its life, so there is a balance point.

[exit90a]

Originally Posted by ghbzorro

Good luck with Honda. Hopefully they will be willing to give you the re-hone and ring job that you probably need.

Now before you say "But I followed their break-in recommendations to the letter", let me mention that if I am ever lucky enough to buy a new bike, I will definitely be following the suggestions given here: Break In Secrets--How To Break In New Motorcycle and Car Engines For More Power

Having said that, I still think it is disappointing to get that kind of oil consumption and Honda oughta fix it.

I used the break in procedure from that article when I got my 07' last January. I have over 3000 miles on the bike now with no oil consumption. The owners manual only said to use care for the first 300 miles and gave no rpm limitations. I had a 99' R1 that was run in "easy" per the mfg and it used 500 - 800 ml of oil every 1000 miles. Yamaha also said service limit was 1 liter per 1000 miles. Way to much if you ask me but I guess it keeps them from fixing a lot of loose engines.

[bonham]

Originally Posted by Sheland

Gradual Progression of RPM - Carefully increase the throttle.
Varying speed - always change the speed (RPM). Constant speed or RPM may cause 'glazing'.
Correct oil - your dealer would have used proper oil. For motorcycles, synthetic oil is not recommended for the first 600 miles.

That's the break-in method I followed, and I'm still using non-synthetic oil. I'll get back to you all once I have 5,000 miles or so on the bike to let you know what my consumption looks like.

[08silvercbr]

I read doomwitha929 s article about break in. My bike has 300 miles on it and I immediately changed the oil last night and followed that method even though it appears too late. I have to say my oil was as black as an abused lease turn in. Don't wait until your 600 mile service dude...get your oil out of there and get fresh in. As far as synthedic goes the owners manual says to use honda NON synthedic so why would they put synthedic in from the factory?? My bike not burning ANY oil so I'd go off on them and make them give you a ring job and then break it in exactly like that article link above!!

[08silvercbr]

So how many miles of normal use would you say it takes to break in a new motor?

[gxtoast]

Originally Posted by 08silvercbr

So how many miles of normal use would you say it takes to break in a new motor?

That's the thing. The run-in period requires that you prepare the motor for the rest of its life. So, running-in with 'normal use' just isn't the right thing to do.

My understanding is that it is best to:
1. Ensure the engine is warm before applying any significant load.
2. Apply the appropriate amount of load on all gears (although probably not to redline) and do it systematically.
3. Don't apply too much load to gears 5 and 6.
4. After a run-in period, where you have systematically applied load, allow the engine to become stone cold.
5. Warm the engine up again and repeat.
6. Change the oil frequently, using 100% high quality mineral or perhaps semi-synth.
7. At some point increasing the aggressiveness of the run-in will potentially shorten the engine's life (but yeild a higher performing engine).

My mechanic said four 50km trips (where you significantly load gears 1 - 4 (less for gears 5 - 6) and allow the engine to become cold between each trip, will complete both an engine AND gearbox run-in. He said a gearbox can take significantly longer to run-in than an engine, but this method will do both.

So, this will effectively prepare your bike in about 200km.

[08silvercbr]

Synthedics in a new motor is an absolute no no. If your dealer only puts in semi synthedic then don't take it to the dealer. You might as well take your bike out and rag the crap out of it. You still need to tell them to stick it Hoody. You paid too much for that bike for that crap! Mine isn't using hardly any.

[wookster]

i picked up my 08 blade on 14th june, and had the 600 mile service on the 19th june, since then it has done 850 miles and yesterday i put 1100ml of oil in it!!!!! i spoke to the dealer and they said to moniter and make a log of how much oil its using, and they would look at it when it goes in for the 4000 mile service.

they also gave me the line about 1l per 1000 miles but that means it would run itself dry between services if it isn't topped up, surely that cant be right?! i topped it up with the recommended 10w 30 castrol semi synthetic which i went and got from the honda dealer. the technician said it should settle down once its got 7000-8000 miles on it, is it me or does that seem a bit co-incidental as the warranty will be close to run out by then? any ideas?

[gotama]

good GOD get it and ride it like you stole it
thats all

[chukky]

The tolerances on todays superbikes are minimal.Your bike should be using NO oil at all.I have a 954 of wich the block cracked wich had 30 000 k's on and it used NO oil .Honda SA replaced the engine for me,lucky me and the technician ran the bike in on the dyno with the new engine in and it uses NO oil.I use only mineral oil,Shell Helix 20W50.You are being taken for a ride as these guys dont want to admit that theres a fault on your bike.If you dont get any joy out of the dealer,go straight to the official Honda Importer and lay a complaint
Cheers
Chukky

[Espresso]

Fellow riders,
Reading this thread got me worried so i went and checked oil level on my 1000RR 2008 and...it was exactly at the same level as when i last changed the oil 1,100 miles ago (about 3 months of riding). I hope it stays that way. So I'm puzzled why the UK bikes are burning oil??? Here are some stats on mine:
total miles = 1800 miles
oil used = 10w40 non-synthetic
breakin period = 700 real easy miles
my riding style = mostly freeway betweeen 5K - 6K RPM; don't do wheelies; don't race; never went above 8K RPM (funny I know).

[gotama]

I just did my 600 mi service at 516 mi, on the 08 graffiti no oil burning here ,its been on city streets and on the freeway for about 20 min for 7 days, note on the freeway Ive been varying the rpm with no WOT 5th or 6th , on the city streets had a couple good take offs but mainly running in 4th, keeping 5th and 6th for the freeway , not showing any signs of abnormal oil consumption

[gotama]

oh ya and never going above 6500rpm