Fireblade 2008 - oil

Hoody · 06-05-2008, 6:17 PM

Hi, I have a 2008 Fireblade. It is 2 months old and nearly done 4,000 miles, since it had the 600 miles service it has used oil. I reported it to the dealer who sold me the bike, they said they will monitor the oil consumption and report to Honda. So I rode round with my dad while he was running in his 2008 R1, we did 700 miles and it used 250 ml of oil, but this was really taking it easy. Honda say this is within the 'normal' tolerance. I have spoken to a couple of friends who have the same bike and they say theirs does not use oil. I have spoken to other lads who have had many new bikes, they say they have never had the problem of oil usage, I relayed this information to the guy I am in communication with at the dealers.

It has already used a noticeable amount of oil in about 100 miles since they measured what it has used, they are having it in for the 4000 mile service next week and they will measure again.

The dealers are playing it down and saying it is normal usage, I on the other hand is not F-ing happy and would not of spent that much cash on a bike to have to carry oil round with me in case it needs it when I go touring

So anyone else using oil, am I fussing over nothing, or what would you do?

Thanks ............ Hoody

*Deathace* · 06-05-2008, 7:06 PM

yet to do my service for the 600 miles (been away working too damn much) but I will keep an eye on it and let you know if anything arises.

Russ

Hoody · 06-06-2008, 6:48 PM

Anybody else got any info

...........Hoody

lanbrown · 06-06-2008, 7:55 PM

It is not uncommon for a new engine to use some oil while it is in the break-in stage. Once you get to 7,000 or 8,000 miles if it still continues, then I would start to push the dealer.

Hoody · 06-09-2008, 2:22 PM

I had to take my Fireblade back to the dealer today to top up with oil.....'again'

It is using 700ml per 1000 miles, I think that is extreem. It is having its 4000 mile service on Thursday so at least it will be topped up again

The dealer said they have been on to Honda, Honda say it is still within the 1L per 1000 mile specification that they give, not sure where it says it but I will investigate. So the dealer gave me the Honda phone number to ring to talk to them about it, I gave details and they said they will ring back tomorrow.
So anyone got any opinions, suggestions ..... anything you would say or want doing, or would you just accept what they say

Thanks ............. Hoody

cbr900091177 · 06-09-2008, 2:46 PM

im no expert but 1L per 1000 miles, seems like its burning way too much oil,i had a new cbr600 few years ago that burnt pretty much no oil,

ghbzorro · 06-09-2008, 2:47 PM

Good luck with Honda. Hopefully they will be willing to give you the re-hone and ring job that you probably need.

Now before you say "But I followed their break-in recommendations to the letter", let me mention that if I am ever lucky enough to buy a new bike, I will definitely be following the suggestions given here: Break In Secrets--How To Break In New Motorcycle and Car Engines For More Power

Having said that, I still think it is disappointing to get that kind of oil consumption and Honda oughta fix it.

cbr900091177 · 06-09-2008, 2:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghbzorro

Good luck with Honda. Hopefully they will be willing to give you the re-hone and ring job that you probably need.

Now before you say "But I followed their break-in recommendations to the letter", let me mention that if I am ever lucky enough to buy a new bike, I will definitely be following the suggestions given here: Break In Secrets--How To Break In New Motorcycle and Car Engines For More Power

Having said that, I still think it is disappointing to get that kind of oil consumption and Honda oughta fix it.

is is such a secret that the manufacturers dont know this method,
or is there a reason they dont recommend it.

ghbzorro · 06-09-2008, 3:00 PM

Well, the reason he gives for the manufacturers keeping it a "secret" is basically that if they gave them these recommendations there could be an implied liability if some noobies killed themselves while following them.

If you read through the whole website info it makes for a pretty compelling argument.

lanbrown · 06-09-2008, 11:49 PM

Hoody,

Go to the dealler more often for the oil check and check the oil with a rag before you go.

kthrockm · 06-11-2008, 10:07 AM

I have had 6 different bikes in the past 3 and a half years (all purchased new except the '03 CBR954RR and all Hondas but one) and never had a problem with any of them burning oil. Currently I have an '06 ST1300A and an '08 CBR1000RR. I have put more than 36,000 miles on the ST1300 without ever having burned any oil. But in the 2500 miles I have put on the CBR I have already had to add a total about a liter of oil (Honda full synthetic HP4s used at 600 mile change and since then). I am very concerned about this. I bought Honda because of their reputation for quality engineering but looks like I may have a problem with this one. This is a new engine with a nickel silicon coating on the heads instead of sleeves like the previous engines. I knew this when I bought it but figured if it was good enough for Honda it was good enough for me, but maybe the use of the nikasil in this engine wasn't as well tested as it should have been. Guess I'm gonna have to fork over the extra $$ for the extended warranty to make sure I'm covered past the initial year. Would love to know more about what the dealers and Honda say in response to oil burning on others' bikes. Watch for oil on your exhaust - I get specks there after every ride.

Hoody · 06-11-2008, 6:02 PM

kthrockm - I am sorry to hear you are having the same trouble as me, Honda are suppose to be phoning me to discuss this two days ago, they had an excuse for not, then someone phoned me today to say they will be phoning tomorrow? 'What a load of shite'. I wish I had kept my ZX6RC1, it did not cost £10k, did not burn oil and was a hoot to ride, just not as fast and as refined

.............Hoody

Stu748R · 06-12-2008, 4:34 AM

Its a 2 stroke.....

Thanks for the heads up on this and will keep a close eye on this.

spiral · 06-12-2008, 6:45 AM

Hoody, I have an 08 blade with the first service well and truly over. I have to say its not burning oil. In any case ask the dealer does he actually know what he's talking about???????

Burning almost a litre of oil every 1600km

thats something to really complain about

. Good luck.

*Deathace* · 06-12-2008, 8:35 AM

Just a bit of a heads up, just had my 600 mile service done and asked them what oil was in it, 10w30 fully synthetic, Don't get me wrong Honda must know what they are doing but it surprised the hell out of me that they used a fully synth from day one, in my experience its normally a mineral or semi synth up to the first service then flush and change it afterwards, being that mineral or semi synth being thicker to cling on to all the **** in the engine after that your good to go.

It also explains the clunky gearbox as there is no viscosity to quieten it down.

Hoody I will keep an eye on the oil consumption and let you know if I have the same problem.

Russ

Slippy · 06-12-2008, 5:20 PM

Now then folks first post in here so be gentle but I couldn't help but hone in on this thread first.

I have a 08 Blade which I topped up with half a liter between the first service and 2000 miles.

I went to Scotland last weekend touring and did about a thousand miles and had to put another half liter in.

My dealer has suggested (Or is hoping) that it will settle down once the engine fully beds in so we'll see.... it was certainly given a bit of a thrashing at the weekend.

Either way I'm watching it very carefully and having ran in five bikes from new this is the first that has used so much oil ....not what I expected from a Honda.

It always has oil spotting on the can and inside the pipes is far from clean unlike my K5 Gixer thou can which was immaculate inside and never ever used a drop

gxtoast · 06-13-2008, 4:59 AM

Anyone notice if the bikes that don't have oil burning issues are using non-synthetic oil? Just a thought.

One thing I saw when checking out the new blade at the local shop, was the large degree of oil in the exhaust.

kthrockm · 06-18-2008, 12:37 PM

I have been watching the oil consumption very carefully since my last post on June 11. At that time I had 2522 miles on the bike and had just added about half a quart (sorry all of you on the metric system). I am now at just over 3000 miles and am nearing the lower limit on the dipstick and will soon need to add oil. I asked the local dealer's chief mechanic about the consumption and he said it was very common on the redesigned CBR600RR for there to be some oil consumption between changes if you often rev the engine in the higher range (above 10,000rpm). He was not surprised that the CBR1000RR was showing similar usage. He wasn't worried about it and said he had seen it enough on bikes that ran fine otherwise. He said the repair for this if it became too excessive (not precisely defined) would be a ring and piston job. My last 500 miles have been pretty sedate. I've only had it above 10K rpm a couple of times and have largely just used the bike to go back and forth to work, but I am still seeing some oil consumption. I am going to do an oil change this weekend and then raise some heck with the bike and see how it does with more aggressive riding. I'll keep you all posted. I have been checking the oil after 30 minute plus rides and after letting the bike cool down for about ten to fifteen minutes. BTW - the HP4s full synthetic seems to be holding up really well. It is still relatively clean and I am seeing no sign of any breakdown or metallic debris in the oil. Guess I'll get a better look when I change it this weekend. The tires (Dunlop Qualifiers) are still the originals, but the back one is getting a little bare on the center. I've purchased a set of Battlax BT016's that I will have put on in a week or so. Those are triple compound on the rear and are supposed to provide longer life. They're putting them on the new gixxer 600s. Figured I'd give them a try.

Slippy · 06-18-2008, 1:46 PM

I spoke to my dealer about this yesterday which promptly sent them into a panic checking the demo bike... anyway they're making some calls and I'll speak when I'm next in.

I'm guessing that Honda will say something like up to a liter per 1000 mile is within range... but I'm not a betting man

splatty · 06-18-2008, 5:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deathace

Just a bit of a heads up, just had my 600 mile service done and asked them what oil was in it, 10w30 fully synthetic, Don't get me wrong Honda must know what they are doing but it surprised the hell out of me that they used a fully synth from day one, in my experience its normally a mineral or semi synth up to the first service then flush and change it afterwards, being that mineral or semi synth being thicker to cling on to all the **** in the engine after that your good to go.

It also explains the clunky gearbox as there is no viscosity to quieten it down.

Hoody I will keep an eye on the oil consumption and let you know if I have the same problem.

Russ

My bad from an earlier post.

Spoke to my dealer last weekend and he informed me that they only ever put semi-synthetic in bikes they are servicing. Is this why mine seems to have not burnt any oil at all, or is it as the mileage is still very low ? ( 800 )

kthrockm · 06-18-2008, 7:23 PM

If you had your oil changed at 600 and only went an additional 200 since then you would probably not notice any excess oil usage yet. Keep watching it - I didn't notice it until 1500 miles, which would be about 900 miles after my first change. My uneducated belief is that the conventional oil would burn more quickly than an ester based full synthetic, so I don't think using a conventional or partial synthetic oil would explain no apparent oil usage. Could be how you ride too - if you are taking it easy during a break in period you would probably not be revving it like you would after the engine is broken in. I followed Honda's advice on break in carefully and didn't ride it hard until after I had several hundred miles on it. Then again maybe you just got lucky and I didn't! I still love the bike. Something about doing a power wheelie at 90mph without even trying that sends shivers up and down my spine. But I'm gonna keep an eye on the oil usage!

Hoody · 06-25-2008, 6:38 PM

Hi all, well things have moved on a little for me and my oil consumption. My bike is currently using about 700ml of oil per 1,000 miles, even since the 4,000 mile service. So after a conversation with a nice lady from Honda they have found it necessary to replace my bike

So I am picking up my new bike next week. I was shocked to be honest, I did not expect them to replace it though. So I am a very happy, the only thing is, will the new one use oil too?

I hope not, as I do not want to have to go through all this again. Which makes me ask, is any one elses using a lot of oil?

.............Hoody

kthrockm · 06-25-2008, 8:00 PM

I used a quart of oil in the last 1000 miles, and am continuing to watch it. Did you speak directly with Honda corporate or with a dealer? Would you mind sending me a private message with the contact information for whoever you spoke with? I would of course try to work it here through my dealer but your example would sure help.

Doomwitha929 · 06-25-2008, 8:41 PM

700ml is about.6 quarts US. I dont know how much oil that bike holds but if its around 4 quarts like most bikes that is insane. In 3000 miles it would use almost 2 quarts so nearly half the oil in the bike. I don't care what BS the dealer feeds you that is wrong. First of all the rings in that engine are set in 50 miles of use and as for the rest of the internals they havd virtually no break in due to the quality and tolerance of modern production methods. This isnt 1962 when an engine would take 1000miles for the bearings and crap to bed in and shed metal into the oil. Second I don't care how you rev that beast it should not use hald its oil before an oil change. In a car that holds 5 quarts using ONE quart between oil changes is iffy much less 2.5. If it continues to use that much oil I would take it back and demand they replace or repair it.

gxtoast · 06-26-2008, 8:27 AM

By the sounds of it, it is still a requirement to seat the rings properly. It is probably just something that is more important on this model then on previous models. That and to use the correct oil.

I spoke to my mechanic about wearing in a motorcycle engine, and he said it is important to seat the rings correctly, even in modern engines. He didn't like the idea of taking it to redline from the get go, adding that it was more important to put load on the engine as you go through the gears, saying you don't, however, want to load 5th and 6th too much.

He said four 50km rides with correct loading/revs, etc, is enough to complete engine wear-in, and also to complete gearbox wear-in. He also said after each 50km run, the bike should be warmed down and then left so the engine becomes stone cold. Then warm-up and repeat the run. Once all four is complete, he changes oil from semi-synth to full synthetic oil.

Doomwitha929 · 06-26-2008, 8:33 PM

as stated above a few posts
Break In Secrets--How To Break In New Motorcycle and Car Engines For More Power
Old time break in does not apply these days.
"The Problem With "Easy Break In" ...
There's a very small window of opportunity to get the rings to seal really well ... the first 20 miles !! "

kthrockm · 06-26-2008, 8:54 PM

I followed Honda's break in instructions to the letter and still I am burning oil. Seating the rings is not the problem here. It appears to be a basic flaw with the engine, perhaps the use of the nikasil coating on the cylinder walls instead of the use of sleeves.

ghbzorro · 06-26-2008, 9:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kthrockm

Seating the rings is not the problem here.

Consuming oil but "seating the rings is not a problem"?

Hmmmm. Then I guess you must have a hole in your crankcase or the oil filter is cross-threaded. That's the only things left.

Doomwitha929 · 06-26-2008, 10:43 PM

could be valve guide seals or aspirating oil through the breather and sucking it into the engine through the airbox. could be a busted oil ring.

Sheland · 06-26-2008, 10:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doomwitha929

as stated above a few posts
Break In Secrets--How To Break In New Motorcycle and Car Engines For More Power
Old time break in does not apply these days.
"The Problem With "Easy Break In" ...
There's a very small window of opportunity to get the rings to seal really well ... the first 20 miles !! "

I have seen the above link popping up in several websites and forums. The author claims that it is a very controversial subject. I would like to disagree with the author and say it is not.

According an engineer at at one of the Japanase big three (auto), the ingredients for proper engine break-in are correct fuel mixture, gradual progression of RPM with varying speed, and correct oil.

Correct fuel mixture - The manufacturer already tuned your engine optimally. We do not have to do anything there.
Gradual Progression of RPM - Carefully increase the throttle.
Varying speed - always change the speed (RPM). Constant speed or RPM may cause 'glazing'.
Correct oil - your dealer would have used proper oil. For motorcycles, synthetic oil is not recommended for the first 600 miles.

Complete piston ring seating will happen in 15 - 20 hours of engine operation.

Even if you folllowed the advice of the 'motoman', the engine might break-in without any problem. However, for long term reliability and perormance, it is better to take a softer approach.

Please follow the manufacturer's recommendation. Not every corporation is trying to mislead us.