[TheTrickster]

That new US white - is very nice!

I've found another difference!

The 2009 model has a different rear tire ?

[JTC]

Actually, seems to me that if a person is not going with the ABS model, the 2008 is a better value as they can be had everywhere in the USA for $9999 and, IMHO, the 2008 color schemes are better. The Phoenix looks like a tatoo or tramp stamp. The white is not as nice as the 2008 UK white. The all black is great - and would look sweet with some red rim decals. But now the MSRP on 2009 is $11,999. If I wait longer the 08 may even come down from $9999.
(PS. the Honda website shows tthat the front suspension travel has been reduced - not sure if true or just an error?)...

[The Gerd]

My fingers are crossed for the Repsol replica to really come out in the states...its just awesome. I would have liked to see the Black scheme with gold...kinda like the R1's euro spec black.

I think the loss in suspension travel was a typo. Honda should take a cue from Suzuki's D-mode button that has three ignition maps so we can have our top end back in America. Also wheres the TC? I figured for sure they would have it stock on a Japanese bike by now.

[The Gerd]

The increase in base price seems a little odd considering the bike hasnt changed much if at all between 08 and 09. The only thing that sucks is I will have to wait til after July to buy my 09, so hopefully by then the price will have come back down to the $9,999 that i got my 08 at. I will still end up paying more than MSRP since I plan on getting an alarm and Lojack the day of purchase because I'm not letting my new baby get stolen easily

[JTC]

...and No Gear Position Indicator..??

[redcbr1000rr]

Originally Posted by The Gerd

Honda should take a cue from Suzuki's D-mode button that has three ignition maps so we can have our top end back in America.

Take a cue that the D-mode button is a worthless gimmick? You can get the top end back (~6 hp) for $150.

Originally Posted by JTC

...and No Gear Position Indicator..??

Eyes on the road/track not on your dash!

[KrazyRdR83]

the non-abs CBR is still $11,999...if you want ABS then it'll run you $12,999, oh, and it'll be a bit heavier. ABS model says it weighs in at 461lbs, non-ABS weighs in 439lbs

[SU LAXPLAYA21]

Hey I am a new member to the board! I look forward to being a part of this site. I have a 2006 CBR600 that I have decided to dedicate to the track. So for the street I was looking to get the 08-09 1000rr. What happened to the metallic blue, and silver with the gold wheels? I saw this on a few sites, but haven't seen it more recently. It is clearly not availble in the US, but is there a way to order the plastics from the UK???? Thanks for the help!

[.OrgOwner]

Originally Posted by KrazyRdR83

the non-abs CBR is still $11,999...if you want ABS then it'll run you $12,999, oh, and it'll be a bit heavier. ABS model says it weighs in at 461lbs, non-ABS weighs in 439lbs

Just 2 more reasons not to bother with ABS...

[08BLADERUNNER]

Originally Posted by .OrgOwner

Just 2 more reasons not to bother with ABS...

and no one has even mentioned that with ABS you can't do a cool smokey rolling burnout to impress your friends with the power of that new ride!

[thelastosirus]

If anybody is really interested, youtube has a Honda made Vid on their new CBS brakes.

YouTube - Honda's new electronic controlled ABS system explained: Pt 1

There are 3 vids total, and I recommend watching all 3 to minimize confusion.

And from what is looks, it is a true brake-by-wire system...when moving. The hydraulics are of the standard type when not moving. When you start moving (>3MPH) a valve re-routes hyd pressure to a feedback sensor. Then the computer determines how much braking to apply to front/rear based on your inputs, then the computer applies the brakes accordingly with separate hyd pumps for the front/rear.

A few things to note:

The "combined" system is only connected electronically.
The hydralic pumps(yes 2) run non-stop while moving.
The ABS works 10 times faster then an automobile ABS system, so you won't feel the brake pulses.
You do not have ANY connection to the wheels except through electrical wires(while moving).


The system is tuned for the race track, so no worries about performance. They have had many skeptics compare the CBS and the normal system, and somewhere like 98% of riders couldn't match the performance of the CBS. The other 2% were professional riders, and were only able match, and even rarely beat the new system after repeated attempts into the same corner.

My personal concern since I will buy this bike, is how long before the system has problems? Hydraulic pumps are not known for having a long life.


BTW..whats the deal with European bikes putting out more HP? The 08-09 fireblades are rated at 178HP, which I didn't believe anyway. Maybe it has to do with the Octane rating over here.

[Rich22]

Originally Posted by 08BLADERUNNER

and no one has even mentioned that with ABS you can't do a cool smokey rolling burnout to impress your friends with the power of that new ride!

That sucks, i did 1 some years back on my 2002 R1, it suddenly bit and looped itself!! nice

[jschaf]

I would get no satisfaction from outtrailbraking someone if I had the assist from ABS & they did not. If both bikes had ABS I might get some satisfaction but I seriously doubt that the corner entry would be safer. Technology marches on. Oh I forgot, I'm trying to subtract weight, not add it.

[thelastosirus]

Originally Posted by jschaf

I would get no satisfaction from outtrailbraking someone if I had the assist from ABS & they did not. If both bikes had ABS I might get some satisfaction but I seriously doubt that the corner entry would be safer. Technology marches on. Oh I forgot, I'm trying to subtract weight, not add it.

Maybe you wouldn't get any satisfaction because you don't have ABS. But I'm sure the guy who just passed you in the corner would be happy.

But that is the truth, there's no stopping technology. Is ABS legal in MotoGP ? Traction Control is, but I never heard anything about ABS. And MotoGP racing is top of the bike racing world. I don't think when somebody is standing on the podium they feel bad for winning because of superior technology. In fact, it's quite a shame what some of those riders have to deal with. And technology comes in all shapes and sizes, from ABS, traction/wheelie control to tires and protective leathers(remember when they never had that speed hump on their upper back?). Some teams were losing because of the shoddy tires they had.

[Deathace]

I would like to see someone use ABS to better you through the bend ???? Up to it maybe but if you want to try trailbraking with ABS whilst leant over in a bend your as mad as a march hare as soon as the abs sensors kick in you will upset the geometry of the bike leant over and it would try and stand the bike up, not something you want it doing without your controlling it.

Because of the linkage between the CBS system it is more designed for those people that panic brake and lock up the front or rear (or both) and therefore it stops applying the pressure and then resumes as it needs to slow down.

I hate ABS is a car and I would hate to have it on a bike, if you cant practise and get used to how your brakes work then maybe you should?

Russ

[Rich22]

Agreed Russ but the fact is that at least 80% of riders do panic brake lock up and fall off so abs in general is going to help the majority, i dont want it but many will

[thelastosirus]

Originally Posted by Deathace

I would like to see someone use ABS to better you through the bend ???? Up to it maybe but if you want to try trailbraking with ABS whilst leant over in a bend your as mad as a march hare as soon as the abs sensors kick in you will upset the geometry of the bike leant over and it would try and stand the bike up, not something you want it doing without your controlling it.

Because of the linkage between the CBS system it is more designed for those people that panic brake and lock up the front or rear (or both) and therefore it stops applying the pressure and then resumes as it needs to slow down.

I hate ABS is a car and I would hate to have it on a bike, if you cant practise and get used to how your brakes work then maybe you should?

Russ

But that is just it! The ABS on this bike is completely different then from any other system. The ABS acts 10 times faster then convential ABS systems. That was one of the problems Honda had to deal with was weight transfer and chassis balance. Part of the programming is to minimize rear wheel lift also.

And what people report is that you wouldn't even know the system is on the bike unless somebody told you. There was a good article I found after some searching that describes exactly how and why the system out-performs everything else. That's where I got all my info from. I'll look for it again and post a link when I find it. It's really interesting, and it was what finally swayed my decision to get the ABS on the Fireblade.

[red08]

I can't wait for ACS (anti crash steering) and ATM (automatic transmission) on a fireblade! It's a real pain in the @$$ trying to deal with steering and that pesky shifting! Having to actually develop the skills neccessary to ride is overrated!

[Deathace]

Rich: I see your point but in all fairness if people buy a fireblade then you would have thought they would have at least the minimal skill to actually ride it how it is rather than having all manner of electronics riding it for them and they are just on the seat perched like a pillion.

TLO: I am not saying that ABS or hondas equivalent is not a marvel of engineering technology what I am saying is that people (who are buying a blade with ABS) will get a false sense of security and think that this all encompassing technology is going to save them in some miraculous fashion if they cock up even the slightest of things.

ABS does not work if the road surface is that bad or has dirt, loose stones, too many bumps etc so the only time you are likely to use it would be in most cases of straight line speed scrubbing or that emergency where someone pulls out on you (still in straight line) as anything else the conditions of the weather, road, distance to obstruction and all manner of other things will make it virtually useless.

But for those who want it I am not saying you should not have it, thats your decision and money to spend but dont expect too much by way of results for your extra $$$ the bike still has only 2 wheels.

RED08: I hear ya but people are welcome to buy what they want in a bike and whatever options and changes they see fit (I have modified mine over the standard) it just seems Honda want to make the fireblade a learner legal safe bike to ride - which in my opinion takes away the pure fun of riding such a bike, If I wanted a ride without doing anything I would go pillion on my wifes automatic Aprilia 850 Mana

Russ

[thelastosirus]

I guess the truth is, electronics are only going to get more prevalent on these bikes. And Honda already stated that they plan to make ABS standard in all their bikes 250cc+up within a few years. The only real reason I decided to get the ABS is around here in Frankfurt, it always rains unexpectedly. Granted, no electronic trickery can defy physics and grip the road when there is no grip, but it might allow me to keep enough control to narrowly avoid some of these "multi-culture drivers"(to put it discreetly). And since it supposedly doesn't feel any different then standard brakes, I figured there shouldn't be anything to worry about.

[thelastosirus]

Originally Posted by red08

I can't wait for ACS (anti crash steering) and ATM (automatic transmission) on a fireblade! It's a real pain in the @$$ trying to deal with steering and that pesky shifting! Having to actually develop the skills neccessary to ride is overrated!

I'm not sure how much you know about racing, but Anti-lock brakes only job is just that, to not lock up. When you're trail-braking into a corner you are balancing braking forces with corning forces. If you do one of those too much, you'll wash out your front end. If you ever watch racing replays of corner crashes when the front end lets go(rare, as riders usually lose the rear instead), the wheel never stops spinning. So ABS has nothing to do with removing the requirements of genuine skill.

[Deathace]

yeah but if you also look at the bikes that are racing most of them have engine retardation, traction control and have probably the best rubber money can buy which does take a lot of skill away from a rider. But then thats all a good thing for the manufacturers cos then people can buy a bike with all these gimmicks and think they can race like Rossi, get killed and then add to the already massive pressure on bikers to give up their pride and joy for the greater good of mankind.

Its all bollox and takes away the riders interaction with the bike - ill keep my wrist making the decisions thanks

Russ

[red08]

Originally Posted by Deathace

I hear ya but people are welcome to buy what they want in a bike and whatever options and changes they see fit

True but I am welcome to post my disgust with Honda for trying to dumb down the king of the hill motorcycle. Hopefully it, and any other junk Honda decides to add in the name of safety, remains an option I can opt-out of.

Originally Posted by thelastosirus

So ABS has nothing to do with removing the requirements of genuine skill.

It just has everything to do with removing the need to develop the most basic of motorcycling skills ... braking in a straight line. Put this junk on an entry level bike, a VFR, a Goldwing, or anything other than the top o' the line hypersport. Not to mentioned the ~22 lbs. it adds back to a bike that has lighter weight as one of its best features.

Originally Posted by Deathace

Its all bollox and takes away the riders interaction with the bike

That about sums it up for me. If I wanted an autopilot-esque experience I'd be driving a cage.

[thelastosirus]

Originally Posted by red08

It just has everything to do with removing the need to develop the most basic of motorcycling skills ... braking in a straight line. Put this junk on an entry level bike, a VFR, a Goldwing, or anything other than the top o' the line hypersport. Not to mentioned the ~22 lbs. it adds back to a bike that has lighter weight as one of its best features.

As all modern sportbikes can flip over the front wheel with the amount of braking power and tire grip while stopping(without the wheel locking), I don't know why you think you wouldn't need the same skills as on a non-ABS Fireblade. Now a non-ABS Goldwing can lock up the front wheel in high-traction conditions, so ABS would take away the requirement for real braking skills on that bike. But not the case on the Fireblade.

Now low traction, ie-wet roads, I do agree you won't need much skill to use the brakes with ABS, where on the non-ABS bikes you better know your stuff.

[red08]

Originally Posted by thelastosirus

As all modern sportbikes can flip over the front wheel with the amount of braking power and tire grip while stopping(without the wheel locking), I don't know why you think you wouldn't need the same skills as on a non-ABS Fireblade.

Then what is the point, again? Honda put this junk on the bike in the name of "safety" (for inexperienced/non-skilled riders) and not in the name of performance. If I was looking for "safety" I wouldn't be riding a 160 rwhp hypersport or any motorcycle for that matter.

As of now we have the best of both worlds. You can have your 1000RR with ABS and the 22 + lbs. that accompany it and I can have my 1000RR they way I want it ... light and powerful without ABS, autoshift, linked brakes, and or an airbag.

[thelastosirus]

Originally Posted by red08

Then what is the point, again? Honda put this junk on the bike in the name of "safety" (for inexperienced/non-skilled riders) and not in the name of performance. If I was looking for "safety" I wouldn't be riding a 160 rwhp hypersport or any motorcycle for that matter.

As of now we have the best of both worlds. You can have your 1000RR with ABS and the 22 + lbs. that accompany it and I can have my 1000RR they way I want it ... light and powerful without ABS, autoshift, linked brakes, and or an airbag.

As I'm kind of a slim guy(160lbs), I just tell myself that at least I'll be as light and fast as an 182lb guy on the same non-ABS bike.

[red08]

Originally Posted by thelastosirus

As I'm kind of a slim guy

I'm not so I need every bit of help I can get.

[FB1000inPA]

Please help me out here and explain.

To have ABS on a bike and to make it work correctly - do you need a special front fork ala BMW?
If so, does the 2008 model have it already since it doesn't look like there were changes between the 2008 and 2009 models.

[red08]

Originally Posted by FB1000inPA

Please help me out here and explain.

To have ABS on a bike and to make it work correctly - do you need a special front fork ala BMW?
If so, does the 2008 model have it already since it doesn't look like there were changes between the 2008 and 2009 models.

There is no difference in the fork that I am aware of. The ABS version has different calipers and rotors. It also has the hydraulic pumps and associated electronic controls. It adds ~22 lbs. to the bike.

[FB1000inPA]

Originally Posted by red08

There is no difference in the fork that I am aware of. The ABS version has different calipers and rotors. It also has the hydraulic pumps and associated electronic controls. It adds ~22 lbs. to the bike.

I must be wrong then. I thought the fork needed to be differently designed to take full advantage of ABS.