2009 Fireblade - CBR1000RR

.OrgOwner · 08-05-2008, 9:01 PM

So the new look fireblade has been with us for a while now, there has been plenty of discussion on the good and bad points so lets step forward a little to the 2009 Fireblade. What changes do you want to see Honda make for the first "revision" of the now class leading machine? What do want from Honda and what do you expect they will actaully do with the new model?

impact1968 · 08-05-2008, 9:48 PM

Restore the missing horsepower on the u.s. model.
A red, white, and blue paint job would be nice.
Include the rear seat cowl with purchase.

Hoody · 08-05-2008, 9:57 PM

The one thing that really lets the 2008 model down for me, is the lack of a gear read out. The rear end could be even better, with intergrated crystal indicators and tail light. More dynamic head lights, the ones now are good but to say it is the Fireblade I am sure there is better? Twin speed damping, maybe? ABS if it is as good as they say it is.

.............. Hoody

Maholli · 08-05-2008, 10:37 PM

Just the Honda quality that we are all used to.. Performance wise the Blade is great... Better more aggressive paint schemes too...

Doomwitha929 · 08-05-2008, 11:17 PM

Better paint, Redesign the lowers a little maybe so they looks less... flat,boring,flat,plain,flat. Change the upper tripple so it looks more quality and less like cheap cast aluminum off a scooter. The exhaust looks like its off the 2nd gen CBR1000 with the can integrated into the body. Thats for scooters not race bikes. I would like to see them change the can so it looks more like a seperate muffler, more like a race machine and less like an Accord.

.OrgOwner · 08-06-2008, 6:50 AM

Looks very much like the new Honda fireblade may run with brake by wire on the 09 CBR600RR, I wonder if it is on the cards for the CBR1000RR or if Honda will save it for the next year when they say it will be used on all road going models over 250cc.

exit90a · 08-06-2008, 7:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by .OrgOwner

Looks very much like Honda may run with brake by wire on the 09 CBR600RR, I wonder if it is on the cards for the CBR1000RR or if Honda will save it for the next year when they say it will be used on all road going models over 250cc.

Brake by wire? Why do we need this? What are the advantages? That sounds dangerous to me. What if the electric goes out at 120 mph? Don't see how the feel would still be there either. Most of this techno-trickery does not make the bikes functionally better IMO.

.OrgOwner · 08-06-2008, 7:30 AM

Science fiction becomes science fact, brake by wire / ABS whatever you want to call it, its here to stay. It has an overide if the electrics fail of course. I tend to agree, all this electronic stuff detracts from the skill and the raw experience. It's sad for us and even worse for our children, they probably won't even get to use the throttle on their bikes.

bladeM3 · 08-06-2008, 7:35 AM

More exciting paint schemes ,better looking front end and re-design the muffler.

MCR001 · 08-06-2008, 7:46 AM

simple - Repsol Replica.

exit90a · 08-06-2008, 7:47 AM

Piston rings which actually seal so folks dont have to add 2 quarts between oil changes.

spiral · 08-06-2008, 5:34 PM

Better paint job, by this I mean MORE of it the paint should be deeper and more clear coat please!!!!!!! the colours this year I like alot.....the euro ones at least.
Better exaust, again I'm not too pushed by the look of the current one but the quality is very poor.
Tidy the rear end a bit, aestetically its the bikes worst feature, a tidy tail is needed.
Give us a rear hugger that does what huggers are meant to do, not like the useless piece of thrash supplied with the bike.
Am I asking too much when I ask for a bike with a fuel gauge?????????

The Gerd · 08-07-2008, 3:58 PM

For 09 I would like to see the missing 10HP return to US bikes, a taller stock windscreen, a gear indicator, and maybe some 5 spoke wheels, the three spoke is so bland.

The ABS is intriguing, its not really brake by wire, you still have a master cylinder and you still have brake feel because its still hydraulic, its just that theres a sensor that detects lock up conditions and it sends a signal to a little black box that will "pulse" the pressure in the brake lines until the lock up condition stops. The only time it would feel any different from normal brakes would be when you reach lock up, and then it interferes for the better. So I would whole heartedly support ABS in the new 09 bike.

Traction Control would also be really slick to have stock.

Some other things I would like but dont forsee happening are quality levers...stock levers = suck, better seat shape for taller riders, and make the weird tag bracket/signal stalk a bolt on affair like the 07-08 R6.

Im sure Honda will address most of the concerns generated about the 08 bike like the whitening exhaust, oil consumption, paint quality, etc. But even with those foibles the bike is still a monster.

The Gerd · 08-07-2008, 4:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spiral

Am I asking too much when I ask for a bike with a fuel gauge?????????

I thought this was pretty funny since every bike ive owned since 2001 had no fuel gauge, hell even my dirt bikes had no gauge, guess I have just gotten used to it, but it wouldnt hurt to have one

Neenja_Jenkins · 08-07-2008, 5:20 PM

I started this exact thread a few days ago... I guess we should scrap it? Maybe merge it?
2009 Blade?

Anyways, number one on the list for me is better paint schemes, and better paint overall. The only paint I really like now is the White/Black that we don't even get here, and the Black (special edition), none of the other colors really do it for me. So overall I'm expecting better colors.

ABS would be nice. Better paint. Better clearcoat.

I guess while we're dreaming, I'm asking for a small redesign; I've grown to love the frontend, but the rest of the bike isn't so graceful from some angles, in fact it looks downright silly in some angles.

Doomwitha929 · 08-07-2008, 8:51 PM

I don't know about bikes but on cars brake by wire is diff then ABS,TCS or the like. Brake by wire like throttle by wire uses a sensor on the lever usually for stroke, speed and force. This info is transferred to a computer that looks at vehicle speed, acceleration, maybe lean angle on a bike, G force etc. It then decides how hard and fast you want to brake from the lever inputs and how much force it can apply to the brakes to achieve this result. In cars it actually works damn good and of course if the electronics fail it still operates like a normal system much like ABS does. The draw back as I see it is added complexity, added cost, added weight and less likely common owners will be able to mod it. Personally I think maybe you could just tear it all off and retro fit normal brakes. Just like abs and traction control in cars it probably will make the bikes easier to ride and safer. Think about going into a corner hot grabbing too much brake and WAM! OH! but wait instead of low siding into a telephone pole the bike slows down but the wheels never brake traction and you ride through the turn. Or maybe you grab some brakes to stop at a light you didn't see turn red till too late but instead of the rear locking up over the patch of coolant in the road the computer transfers more force to the front and you stop in time.

joema · 08-08-2008, 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doomwitha929

...Brake by wire like throttle by wire uses a sensor on the lever...info is transferred to a computer...It then decides how hard and fast you want to brake from the lever inputs and how much force it can apply to the brakes to achieve this result. In cars it actually works damn good and of course if the electronics fail it still operates like a normal system much like ABS does....Think about going into a corner hot grabbing too much brake and WAM! OH! but wait instead of low siding into a telephone pole the bike slows down but the wheels never brake traction...

Brake by wire is similar to drive-by-wire throttle which several bikes (e.g, R6) already have). The throttle cable or brake line is replaced by a wire, and (as stated) the computer decides how much throttle/brake to apply.

However many bikes with throttle cables are ALREADY essentially drive-by-wire. The cable turns a potentiometer attached to the throttle bodies, which in turn tells the computer how much fuel to inject. There's a physical cable but the computer has the final decision.

Likewise the upcoming Honda sportbike ABS -- despite the "brake by wire" nomenclature -- apparently retains hydraulic lines and front/rear master cylinders.

Instead of running directly to the front/rear calipers, the hydraulic lines go to a computerized control box which controls and modulates the hydraulic force sent to the calipers.

This is probably a conservative design choice vs an end-to-end brake-by-wire system. This way a computer or electronic failure can revert to manual braking, which would be impossible with only a wire from brake lever to computer.

See:
Honda Worldwide | June 9, 2008 "Honda Announces World's First Electronically-Controlled “Combined ABS” for Super Sport Bikes"
Honda Worldwide | Technology Close-up

Performance-oriented motorcycle ABS is very different from car ABS. Unlike cars they don't necessarily buzz or vibrate when activated. They can be very unobtrusive.

However motorcycle ABS (whether brake-by-wire or not) does not understand bank angles or the traction "pie chart" -- how much grip is used by cornering vs how much remains for braking. They will not generally save you from over-braking in a corner.

It will save you from over-braking in a straight line. The Honda system also dynamically proportions braking force between front and rear wheel. This reduces front end dive and shortens braking distance.

Doomwitha929 · 08-08-2008, 7:15 PM

sounds like the brake by wire system is just like automotive ABS as far as still using hydraulics and a modulator that just controls the pressure in the lines to the calipers. Really that wouldnt be brake by wire at all so I am guessing they just use the term for marketing sake. From what you are saying about the abs only really only working in a straight line it dosent sound like its worth it. Stopping in a straight like is not usually the problem but I guess if they are building it someone must think there is a need for it.

joema · 08-09-2008, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doomwitha929

sounds like the brake by wire system is just like automotive ABS...Really that wouldnt be brake by wire...abs only really only working in a straight line it dosent sound like its worth it. Stopping in a straight like is not usually the problem...

The definition is tricky. Early automotive and some current bike ABS were hydraulic/mechanical. There was no computer involved.

The upcoming Honda ABS uses hydraulics and master cylinders, but the hydraulic lines go to a computerized box which determines brake application. In this sense it's brake by wire.

That's also how many "fly by wire" airliners work -- they still use hydraulic lines but they're routed to/from a module which determines control surface movement. The term "fly by wire" or "drive by wire" doesn't necessarily mean an end-to-end wire with no hydraulics.

However many modern automotive ABS systems use a microprocessor-based ABS control module. It interrupts the hydraulic path and determines braking force. Yet we don't generally call those "brake by wire". So you're right in that sense the new Honda system doesn't seem dramatically different from this.

Working only in a straight line is definitely worth it. Unlike a non-ABS car where over-braking may cause a slight skid, over-braking in a bike often causes a crash. Many bike accidents are caused by over-braking and going down, or under-braking and hitting an obstacle.

The best riders on earth -- MotoGP racers -- occasionally over-brake and go down. They're way better than us, but they make mistakes. ABS isn't permitted in MotoGP for regulatory reasons, not because it wouldn't work.

CBRPJK · 08-11-2008, 11:15 PM

I am new to this forum but with my limited knowledge I would say, for 2009:

1) fix oil usage problems
2) fix transmission problems (read about this problem of shifting from 2nd to 3rd??)
3) make black and white UK color scheme available in US!!!

Cheers

CBR929RE · 08-11-2008, 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CBRPJK

I am new to this forum but with my limited knowledge I would say, for 2009:

1) fix oil usage problems
2) fix transmission problems (read about this problem of shifting from 2nd to 3rd??)
3) make black and white UK color scheme available in US!!!

Cheers

I'd say those and just new colors will be what we'll all get.

Neenja_Jenkins · 08-12-2008, 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CBRPJK

I am new to this forum but with my limited knowledge I would say, for 2009:

1) fix oil usage problems
2) fix transmission problems (read about this problem of shifting from 2nd to 3rd??)
3) make black and white UK color scheme available in US!!!

Cheers

If we get all three of these I'll be giddy like a schoolgirl!

red08 · 08-12-2008, 5:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CBRPJK

I am new to this forum but with my limited knowledge I would say, for 2009:

1) fix oil usage problems If it is indeed a manufacturer problem.
2) fix transmission problems (read about this problem of shifting from 2nd to 3rd??) Haven't heard of or experienced this.
3) make black and white UK color scheme available in US!!! BFD - Not interested.

Cheers

Litre Kid · 08-15-2008, 12:19 AM

Dont forget the power loss to US bikes. We want out power back!!!!

laubin · 08-15-2008, 12:32 AM

both headlights on for low beam!!!!

red08 · 08-15-2008, 3:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by laubin

both headlights on for low beam!!!!

Can't see 'em when your riding. So ... why is that important?

08silvercbr · 08-15-2008, 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by laubin

both headlights on for low beam!!!!

Actually had someone stop, wait for me to take off my helmet to tell me I had a burned out headlight!

CBRCrazze · 08-16-2008, 12:46 AM

The pipe needs changed for sure its hard to find a custom pipe for this year....and i would llike to see red..white..and black paint on the bike it looks real race like....maybe a better headlight on it also at least a brighter one anyways....rather than that this bike is running good i sold mine hopeing to get the new 09 sometime soon....so i await.........

red08 · 08-16-2008, 9:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 08silvercbr

Actually had someone stop, wait for me to take off my helmet to tell me I had a burned out headlight!

To which you reply "you are a moron".

The Gerd · 08-16-2008, 5:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CBRCrazze

The pipe needs changed for sure its hard to find a custom pipe for this year....and i would llike to see red..white..and black paint on the bike it looks real race like....maybe a better headlight on it also at least a brighter one anyways....rather than that this bike is running good i sold mine hopeing to get the new 09 sometime soon....so i await.........

Wait...you had an 08, then sold it, all in hopes that Honda will make the 09 better?

I doubt very seriously that Honda will make enough changes to the bike that selling a brand new 08 would make any sense.

As for finding a pipe, I guess its just personal preference but I've seen at least 4 different pipes that I wouldnt mind having, once I feel like the bike needs more power. As far as that goes, I plan on keeping my exhaust stock for a while, but I do plan on a PCIII and IM to get my top end back.

As for the headlight I really dont see an issue here, I ride with my high beams on all the time, which is more than enough light for me to ride at night or day with

I would like some angel eye lenses with a stock bike, all the aftermarket kits are pretty cheaply made.

Ah, the ever lasting battle for paint schemes that everyone will love. I tried to get the all black, but they ran out of them, so I got my next best choice in the Red and Silver, pics cant do this color scheme justice, in person this scheme is gorgeous. But once again for Honda to make everyone happy they will need to have about 100 different colors, and then another 20 race replicas. If the colors dont float your boat but you really want the bike for what it can do, save up for a custom paint job, like the guy who got his Repsol Scheme done professionally. If they bring the white and black to the states, I will gladly not care, since everyone and their grandmother will be on one, and then my bike will be the rarer color. So no matter what colors they add, whatever color we dont get in one region will be wanted in another, it the nature of the beast.

On that note, long live the Blade in whatever iterations Honda dreams up