[FB1000inPA]

...and tell me if there should be a bail-out??

Saw this on another forum and thought I would share it here. It shows what some Union workers do during their lunch break. I know that there are bad workers everywhere but I thought this was surprising to me...

http://www.clickondetroit.com/video/10235271/index.html

Its an undercover video done by a newstation in Detroit.

[lanbrown]

The sad part, the UAW protects these people. It will be hard for Ford to fire them, even though Ford is the one signing the paycheck.

[FB1000inPA]

Originally Posted by lanbrown

The sad part, the UAW protects these people. It will be hard for Ford to fire them, even though Ford is the one signing the paycheck.

Right. I googled a little.

Can't fire'em either..they'd get 95% wages for 4 years acc to their contract

[Twincam]

Thats disgraceful... Wouldn't they be unfit to work after boozing it up? I would think that they drink at night, and then come and drink more making them unfit for work? (and over the limit)

[bladeracer]

I would think having alcohol in their systems at work would be sufficient to have them fired with no recriminations - at least, it would in the real world. Maybe not in the fantasy world that hard working Americans are subsidising for these 'soles.

[.OrgOwner]

The US needs more "real world" workers and less passengers if it's ever going to find it's feet again. They need to sort out clowns like this and send them packing.

[jkobflys]

Sad indeed.
These companies are looking for a bail out, but are so wastefull and inconsiderate.
It really upsets me, they will give them billions of our hard earned taxes and they will laugh all the way to the bank so unfair, tax the $30,000 a year waitress and give it to the $80,000 a year drunk son of a b**ch that rivets the same fu%&^n hole all day long...
at least i have some satisfaction thru my job I'm the Ahole installing and engineering fully automated manufacturing systems to kick the s@*t out these aholes and their Unions
sorry guys if i come across as a total jerk but its so unfair and wastefull.
to think that some people get it so easy and are total bloodsuckers...

[sumthin_major]

Originally Posted by jkobflys

Sad indeed.
These companies are looking for a bail out, but are so wastefull and inconsiderate.
It really upsets me, they will give them billions of our hard earned taxes and they will laugh all the way to the bank so unfair, tax the $30,000 a year waitress and give it to the $80,000 a year drunk son of a b**ch that rivets the same fu%&^n hole all day long...
at least i have some satisfaction thru my job I'm the Ahole installing and engineering fully automated manufacturing systems to kick the s@*t out these aholes and their Unions
sorry guys if i come across as a total jerk but its so unfair and wastefull.
to think that some people get it so easy and are total bloodsuckers...

You don't offend me brother. I'm a maintence guy at a plant that is 80 percent automated . I work on the robots, cranes, forklifts, and anything else that's broke around the plant weather it has a plc or a human running it. Some people jus give the average factory worker a bad name. I have never thought about drinkin on the job. I have to work around too many machines that Would Kill me if my thinking wasn't clear.

[jkobflys]

Originally Posted by sumthin_major

You don't offend me brother. I'm a maintence guy at a plant that is 80 percent automated . I work on the robots, cranes, forklifts, and anything else that's broke around the plant weather it has a plc or a human running it. Some people jugs give the average factory worker a bad name. I have never thought about drinkin on the job. I have to work around too many machines that Would Kill me if my thinking wasn't clear.

Just to clarify..
I don't have anything personal against union workers, my own brother is a maintenance mech at the biggest union refinery down in Torrance ca. and not all are like the ones in the vid. but not all are also asking for a bail out, i heard that the UAW refused to cut back wages to the level of non union plants in the states and why? i guess these union guys needed for the bar tab....

[sumthin_major]

I couldn't afford to sit at a bar and drink for 3 or 4 hours everyday. But I don't make more than 40 a year either. On another note. Why don't they follow the bank exec's around alittle and see where our 700 billion went to.

[jkobflys]

private jets, ivy league trust funds for unappreciative children and the debauchery of the rich...

[sumthin_major]

How about a $500,000 vacation for a few folks . Oh yea , and call it a meeting.

[slickwill]

More that pisses me off.

According to Forbes:

Quote:
Labor cost per hour, wages and benefits for hourly workers.
Ford: $70.51 ($141,020 per year)
GM: $73.26 ($146,520 per year)
Chrysler: $75.86 ($151,720 per year)
Toyota, Honda, Nissan (in U.S.): $48.00 ($96,000 per year)
Quote:


According to AAUP and IES, the average annual compensation for a college
professor in 2006 was $92,973 (average salary nationally of $73,207 + 27%
benefits).

Bottom Line: The average UAW worker with a high school degree earns 57.6%
more compensation than the average university professor with a Ph.D., and
52.6% more than the average worker at Toyota, Honda or Nissan.

Many industry analysts say the Detroit Three, must be on par with Toyota
and Honda to survive. This year's contract, they say, must be
"transformational" in reducing pension and health care costs.

What would "transformational" mean? One way to think about
"transformational" would mean that UAW workers, most with a high school
diploma, would have to accept compensation equal to that of the average
university professor with a PhD.


Then there's the "Job Bank"

When a D3 (Detroit 3 carmaker) lays an employee off, that employee
continues to receive all benefits - medical, retirement, etc., etc., PLUS
an hourly wage of $31/hour.

Here's a typical story....

Ken Pool is making good money. On weekdays, he shows up at 7 a.m. at
Ford Motor Co.'s Michigan Truck Plant in Wayne, signs in, and then starts
working -- on a crossword puzzle. Pool hates the monotony, but the pay is
good: more than $31 an hour, plus benefits.

"We just go in and play crossword puzzles, watch videos that someone
brings in or read the newspaper," he says. "Otherwise, I just sit."

Pool is one of more than 12,000 American autoworkers who, instead of
installing windshields or bending sheet metal, spend their days counting
the hours in a jobs bank set up by Detroit automakers as demanded by the
United Auto Workers Union - UAW - as part of an extraordinary job security
agreement.


Now the D3 wants Joe Taxpayer to pick up this tab in a $25 Billion bailout
package - soon to be increased to $45 Billion if Nancy Pelosi and Hillary
Clinton have their way.

The "Big 3" want this money - not to build better autos. No. They want
it to pay the tab for Medical and Retirement benefits for RETIRED auto
workers. Not ONE PENNY would be used to make them more competitive, or
to improve the quality of their cars.

We ALL have problems paying for our Medical Insurance - but the Democrat
leaders in Congress now want us to pay the Medical Insurance premiums of
folks who have RETIRED from Ford, GM and Chrysler.

[slickwill]

And more, how about six figures for mowing the lawn or driving a forklift.

According to the National Review:
Massive job cuts at General Motors, America's largest carmaker — coupled with the bankruptcy of Delphi, America's biggest autoparts maker — have provoked predictable handwringing from liberal pundits who worry that America is "losing its manufacturing base." But the wrenching change now buffeting the auto industry defies the usual press formulas. Just listen to Steve Miller a turnaround specialist who is steering Delphi's restructuring process. He exploded the myth of America's "endangered" union manufacturing jobs at his October press conference announcing Delphi's move into Chapter 11: "We cannot continue to pay $65 an hour for someone to cut the grass and remain competitive."
Take grass cutting. As defined by the current United Auto Worker contract negotiated with the "Big Five" (GM, Ford, Chrysler, and top parts makers Delphi and Visteon), an auto "production worker" is a job description that covers anything from mowing grass to cleaning the toilets. In the real world, these jobs would be outsourced to $8 an hour, no-benefit wage earners, but on Planet Big Five, these jobs get the same wages as any auto line-worker: an average $26 an hour ($60,000 a year) plus benefits that bring the company's total cost per worker to a staggering $65 an hour.
But at least the grass cutters are working for their pay. The UAW contract also guarantees that 12,000 autoworkers get full wage for doing nothing. On the heels of Miller's straight-talk, the Detroit News reported that "12,000 American autoworkers, instead of bending sheet metal, spend their days counting the hours in a jobs bank." These aren't jobs. And they certainly aren't being "lost" to China.
"We just go in (to Ford's Michigan Truck Plant) and play crossword puzzles, watch videos that someone brings in or read the newspaper," The News quoted one UAW worker as saying. "Otherwise, I've just sat."
The coming months will be painful for many American autoworkers. Accustomed to a certain lifestyle, they will see their wages cut in half, jeopardizing second homes, college tuitions, and car payments. One blue-collar Delphi worker interviewed by the Detroit News makes $103,000 a year operating a forklift and fears the consequences if his pay is drastically reduced. But many Americans will ask how a forklift operator felt entitled to a six-figure income in the first place (according to Bureau of Labor Statistics, the average forklift operator wage in the U.S. is $26,000).
It is an opportune time for political leadership to step to the plate and speak with candor, but the signs are not encouraging.
- November 29, 2005, Labor Pains, Detroit needs to play by market rules. By Henry Payne

[jkobflys]

Originally Posted by slickwill

More that pisses me off.

According to Forbes:

Quote:
Labor cost per hour, wages and benefits for hourly workers.
Ford: $70.51 ($141,020 per year)
GM: $73.26 ($146,520 per year)
Chrysler: $75.86 ($151,720 per year)
Toyota, Honda, Nissan (in U.S.): $48.00 ($96,000 per year)
Quote:


According to AAUP and IES, the average annual compensation for a college
professor in 2006 was $92,973 (average salary nationally of $73,207 + 27%
benefits).

Bottom Line: The average UAW worker with a high school degree earns 57.6%
more compensation than the average university professor with a Ph.D., and
52.6% more than the average worker at Toyota, Honda or Nissan.

Many industry analysts say the Detroit Three, must be on par with Toyota
and Honda to survive. This year's contract, they say, must be
"transformational" in reducing pension and health care costs.

What would "transformational" mean? One way to think about
"transformational" would mean that UAW workers, most with a high school
diploma, would have to accept compensation equal to that of the average
university professor with a PhD.


Then there's the "Job Bank"

When a D3 (Detroit 3 carmaker) lays an employee off, that employee
continues to receive all benefits - medical, retirement, etc., etc., PLUS
an hourly wage of $31/hour.

Here's a typical story....

Ken Pool is making good money. On weekdays, he shows up at 7 a.m. at
Ford Motor Co.'s Michigan Truck Plant in Wayne, signs in, and then starts
working -- on a crossword puzzle. Pool hates the monotony, but the pay is
good: more than $31 an hour, plus benefits.

"We just go in and play crossword puzzles, watch videos that someone
brings in or read the newspaper," he says. "Otherwise, I just sit."

Pool is one of more than 12,000 American autoworkers who, instead of
installing windshields or bending sheet metal, spend their days counting
the hours in a jobs bank set up by Detroit automakers as demanded by the
United Auto Workers Union - UAW - as part of an extraordinary job security
agreement.


Now the D3 wants Joe Taxpayer to pick up this tab in a $25 Billion bailout
package - soon to be increased to $45 Billion if Nancy Pelosi and Hillary
Clinton have their way.

The "Big 3" want this money - not to build better autos. No. They want
it to pay the tab for Medical and Retirement benefits for RETIRED auto
workers. Not ONE PENNY would be used to make them more competitive, or
to improve the quality of their cars.

We ALL have problems paying for our Medical Insurance - but the Democrat
leaders in Congress now want us to pay the Medical Insurance premiums of
folks who have RETIRED from Ford, GM and Chrysler.

Originally Posted by slickwill

And more, how about six figures for mowing the lawn or driving a forklift.

[slickwill]

The problem is that most people are completely unaware of the situation. If they were aware of this there'd be an outcry. I'm trying to spread the word.

Notice the date on the one article. It was 2005. People have known about the problem for quite some time but mainstream media ignores it. The whole point of the article by Payne in '05 was that if the situation wasn't fixed the big three would be in big trouble. Well here it is and three years later and look at where we are.

[BigBassTurd]

I think I just found my new job! Where do I get an application at?

[setanta]

Originally Posted by slickwill

More that pisses me off.

According to Forbes:

Quote:
Labor cost per hour, wages and benefits for hourly workers.
Ford: $70.51 ($141,020 per year)
GM: $73.26 ($146,520 per year)
Chrysler: $75.86 ($151,720 per year)
Toyota, Honda, Nissan (in U.S.): $48.00 ($96,000 per year)
Quote:

When a D3 (Detroit 3 carmaker) lays an employee off, that employee
continues to receive all benefits - medical, retirement, etc., etc., PLUS
an hourly wage of $31/hour.

Here's a typical story....

Ken Pool is making good money. On weekdays, he shows up at 7 a.m. at
Ford Motor Co.'s Michigan Truck Plant in Wayne, signs in, and then starts
working -- on a crossword puzzle. Pool hates the monotony, but the pay is
good: more than $31 an hour, plus benefits.

"We just go in and play crossword puzzles, watch videos that someone
brings in or read the newspaper," he says. "Otherwise, I just sit."

Pool is one of more than 12,000 American autoworkers who, instead of
installing windshields or bending sheet metal, spend their days counting
the hours in a jobs bank set up by Detroit automakers as demanded by the
United Auto Workers Union - UAW - as part of an extraordinary job security
agreement.


Now the D3 wants Joe Taxpayer to pick up this tab in a $25 Billion bailout
package - soon to be increased to $45 Billion if Nancy Pelosi and Hillary
Clinton have their way.

"Snipped"

Ok tell me how this is justifiable and why has there not been a huge outcry about it?
AlsoI dont understand that if an employee is hired to do Xhours a week but spends 10+ in absenteeism a week, why cant he be fired??
This is the strangest thing I have ever come across in the workplace

[bladeracer]

I'd be interested to know if any of these auto workers have tried to justify the money they've been getting.
Don't we have any auto workers on Fireblades?
I can imagine what those that work outside of Detroit think of it but I'd like to know what the workers themselves believe makes them so special.