[Baketech]

The story breaks of Saddam and UN employees siphoning 10 Billion dollars from the "Oil For Food" program, and there is no discussion? Billions of our tax dollars went to build weapons, palaces and line the pockets of UN officials while the Iraqi people suffered, and not one post....?


Next time I leave for a few days, I guess I will appoint a stand in muckraker....you guys are pathetic....

[Zeeman]

Haven't been in the loop for news of late. When and where did this news break?


Z...

[Baketech]

Here's one version...

[CBRVFR]

Originally Posted by Baketech

The story breaks of Saddam and UN employees siphoning 10 Billion dollars from the "Oil For Food" program, and there is no discussion? Billions of our tax dollars went to build weapons, palaces and line the pockets of UN officials while the Iraqi people suffered, and not one post....?


Next time I leave for a few days, I guess I will appoint a stand in muckraker....you guys are pathetic....

Accusations of corruption have plagued the oil-for-food program since its inception

Sorry to disappoint you, Bake, but that particular kitten has been embalmed for a decade at least ! Did you have expectations of some kind of ethical standard being operative ??

[Holeshot]

Originally Posted by CBRVFR

Sorry to disappoint you, Bake, but that particular kitten has been embalmed for a decade at least ! Did you have expectations of some kind of ethical standard being operative ??

Exactly. When the UN spends like they do to take trips to *world hunger converences* and the like, would you expect any less. My cousing, the Lt. Col covered it best in an e-mail just a few days ago:

Ship the UN Headquarters to an isolated island some place. We don't need the spies and fair weather friends here. Besides, the building would make a good homeless shelter or lockup for illegal aliens.

(sorry, I can't confirm the original source)

[Mo Noyz]

Among a boatload of other absurdities, Libya heads the U.N. Human Rights Commission.

And we're supposed to be suprised at their "oil for food" dealings?

The U.N. is the most corrupt organization on the planet. Period. They are worthless and pitiful. And should Kerry become President, *shudder*, we will be back to kneeling at their alter.

THATS what disgusts me!

Yes, get the U.N. off American soil, and fully withdraw from the U.N.!

[rocket]

[quote=Mo Noyz]Among a boatload of other absurdities, Libya heads the U.N. Human Rights Commission.

And we're supposed to be suprised at their "oil for food" dealings?

The U.N. is the most corrupt organization on the planet. Period. They are worthless and pitiful. And should Kerry become President, *shudder*, we will be back to kneeling at their alter.

THATS what disgusts me!

Yes, get the U.N. off American soil, and fully withdraw from the U.N.![/QUOTE

The UN is a joke. The color of their headgear says it all.
Why Baby blue? What candy ass picked baby freakin blue? Nothing against blue but why would you put that on a soldier?

[BrianG]

I think that if you look to the records, you'll find that the USA has not lived up to it's financial obligations to the UN for decades. It is, in fact, millions and millions of $$$ in arrears to the organization.

Argue the value of the UN all you like, and maybe even rationalize the lack of US responsibility in making the payments, but effectively, you've already withdrawn!

[CBRVFR]

17 November 1999

US pays a hungry world -
From The Australian

THE White House has claimed victory in a seven-year struggle to persuade Congress to release almost $US1 billion ($1.53 billion) in back payments to the UN, just days after the international body released a study documenting the desperate plight of the world's hungry

Urban legend - that was over by the time Clinton left office. And the US has historically paid far more than other countries for the administration of the UN ( other than $ for some politically oriented "agencies".) Not to mention that not only did we give them a nice piece of NY Cityfor their building, we just loaned them millions to fix it up. Personally, I would have suggested that their cash would go farther in, say, Quebec..

[Baketech]

Updated Story

FULL LINK

Saddam Got $21 Billion from UN Oil Program -U.S. Panel
Reuters
By Chris Baltimore

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Saddam Hussein (news - web sites)'s regime reaped over $21 billion from kickbacks and smuggling before and during the now-defunct U.N. oil-for-food program, twice as much as previous estimates, according to a U.S. Senate probe on Monday.

The monies flowed between 1991 and 2003 through oil surcharges, kickbacks on civilian goods and smuggling directly to willing governments, Senate investigators said at a hearing.

"How was the world so blind to this massive amount of influence-peddling?" asked Republican Sen. Norm Coleman (news, bio, voting record), head of the investigations subcommittee.

Coleman made public more documents he said were evidence of bigger kickbacks and payments than what was previously known, including 2003 data previously not reviewed.

The new Senate figure is about double the amount estimated by the U.S. Government Accountability Office, which had pegged it at $10.1 billion. Charles Duelfer, the chief U.S. weapons inspector in Iraq (news - web sites), had estimated about the same amount based on Iraqi documents, with $2 billion through the U.N. program and $8 billion in smuggling by road or sea or in direct illegal agreements with governments.

The oil-for-food program began in December 1996 to alleviate the impact on ordinary Iraqis of sanctions, imposed when Iraq invaded Kuwait in August 1990. The U.N. Security Council allowed Iraq to sell oil and buy food, medicine and other goods and let Baghdad draw up its own contracts.

This left room for abuse in the $64 billion program, administered by the United Nations (news - web sites) and monitored by a U.N. Security Council panel, including the United States, according to investigators.

Oil smuggling alone netted Saddam's regime about $9.7 billion, with other funds flowing from switching substandard goods with top-grade ones, as well as exploiting food and medicine shipments to the Kurds in Iraq's north.

Panel investigators also echoed the findings by Duelfer, head of the CIA (news - web sites)-led Iraq Survey Group, that Saddam's regime gave lucrative contracts to buy Iraqi oil to high-ranking officials in Russia, France and other nations.

On the list of 270 individuals, businesses and political parties was the head of the U.N. oil-for-food program, Benon Sevan, who has vigorously denied the charges.

Other recipients include Russian ultranationalist Vladimir Zhirinovsky and his Russian Liberal Democrat Party. The Senate panel released a document signed by Zhirinovsky in January 1999 that invited a U.S. oil company to Moscow to negotiate to buy the oil voucher. The name of the U.S. company was withheld because of pending investigations, panel staff said.

In Russian press statements, Zhirinovsky has denied taking bribes from Saddam's regime, though he admitted meeting with the former Iraqi president during trips to Baghdad.

Senior Iraqi officials like former Iraqi deputy prime minister Tareq Aziz were also personally involved in oil talks, Senate panel investigators said.

In each case, Saddam's regime awarded a certificate that allowed the holder to sell the right to buy Iraqi oil at below-market prices.

The certificate holder would charge a per-barrel commission to transfer the rights to an oil buyer. Per-barrel fees were usually less than $1 per barrel but racked up big dollar amounts because allocations upward of 1 million barrels were routine.

The United Nations has refused to hand over documents to a U.S. congressional committee or allow Sevan to appear before a panel while its own investigation is under way, led by Paul Volcker, the former U.S. Federal Reserve (news - web sites) chairman.

U.N. spokesman Fred Eckhard said in New York that Secretary-General Kofi Annan (news - web sites) had telephoned Coleman and Senator Carl Levin, a Michigan Democrat, "to assure them we are not being obstructionist" following an angry letter last week from the two senators.

[sheepofblue]

UN is corrupt, fish like water, people breath air hmmm I don't state any of these often.

[nedro]

Originally Posted by BrianG

I think that if you look to the records, you'll find that the USA has not lived up to it's financial obligations to the UN for decades. It is, in fact, millions and millions of $$$ in arrears to the organization.

Argue the value of the UN all you like, and maybe even rationalize the lack of US responsibility in making the payments, but effectively, you've already withdrawn!

So tell me Einstein, How much more money did Canada give to the UN than the USA did?
Please! I am truelly interested.
(where's the "I'm all ears" emotican when you need it?)

[sheepofblue]

Originally Posted by BrianG

I think that if you look to the records, you'll find that the USA has not lived up to it's financial obligations to the UN for decades. It is, in fact, millions and millions of $$$ in arrears to the organization.

Argue the value of the UN all you like, and maybe even rationalize the lack of US responsibility in making the payments, but effectively, you've already withdrawn!

Actually I believe the current evil administration brought us current. However the real cure is to bulldoze that pile of

[luvtolean]

Originally Posted by sheepofblue

Actually I believe the current evil administration brought us current. However the real cure is to bulldoze that pile of

My sentiments exactly!

[oldfogey]

Did you guys ever find a situation where talking it over produced a better solution than pulling a gun?

[sheepofblue]

Originally Posted by oldfogey

Did you guys ever find a situation where talking it over produced a better solution than pulling a gun?

Often my problem with the UN is they think they are a world government, it is heavily populated by dictators, we pay a tax based on GDP but there is no equivalent accountability, the politics they push would SEVERELY limit my freedoms. And that was just off the top of my head. If they ONLY provided a place for gov's to get together and talk my problem would be == 0.

Oh and unfortunately sometimes you do need the gun. Not all people are reasonable enough to get along with.

[oldfogey]

Originally Posted by sheepofblue

Often my problem with the UN is they think they are a world government, it is heavily populated by dictators, we pay a tax based on GDP but there is no equivalent accountability, the politics they push would SEVERELY limit my freedoms. And that was just off the top of my head. If they ONLY provided a place for gov's to get together and talk my problem would be == 0.

Most taxes are based on income and voting on per person [=country], that's democracy. The security council recognises some form of power restriction in its construction. I'm not defending value for money at the UN, there's work to be done there, just like any bunch of politicians who can vote themselves more money.

Originally Posted by sheepofblue

Oh and unfortunately sometimes you do need the gun. Not all people are reasonable enough to get along with.

Agreed, but the occasions when using the gun produces a better result are sadly few and far between. WWII is probably the honourable example. Having the threat and not having to use it, would be ideal. Again, agreed there are some crazies who you need to isolate or shoot, not talk with.

[sheepofblue]

Originally Posted by oldfogey

Agreed, but the occasions when using the gun produces a better result are sadly few and far between. WWII is probably the honourable example. Having the threat and not having to use it, would be ideal. Again, agreed there are some crazies who you need to isolate or shoot, not talk with.

You might add the cold war, the show of force kept the peace. And for an American add the Civil War, extremely bloody but the end results have been well worth it.

[oldfogey]

Originally Posted by sheepofblue

You might add..the Civil War, extremely bloody but the end results have been well worth it.

Interesting question there. Any ideas what North America would have been like if the Civil War had ended in stalemate or victory for the South? Any good quasi-history books on the subject?

[luvtolean]

Originally Posted by oldfogey

Interesting question there. Any ideas what North America would have been like if the Civil War had ended in stalemate or victory for the South?

It could never end in stalemate.

My guess would be a disjointed set of states that would have never got together and produced a great country.

[Baketech]

I would also be interested in a reading a book on the subject...anyone have info on one?