Legalise Drugs, cut crime?

oldfogey · 10-07-2004, 9:52 AM

OK, let's find out whether the Republicans here are libertarians or conservatives.

See my comments in the carrying firearms thread.

Would legalising drugs and taxing them heavily (rerun of the post-prohibition policies) cut crime and improve public morals?

Thoughts, please, ladies and gentlemen.

ccwilli3 · 10-07-2004, 10:00 AM

I think if *MOST* drugs are legalized, a lot of crime would go away. Lots of crime is drug related and thefts are born from the need for more money to buy more drugs.

Prohibition was a big deal in our country a while back, once legalized, drugs became the new "underground"...

Granted, I don't really wanna see heroin or crack legalized, but some legalization would lower crime somewhat, IMHO...

ND4SPD · 10-07-2004, 10:04 AM

The only reason it's not legal already is because the government hasn't found a way to control it and tax it.

figment · 10-07-2004, 10:25 AM

Recreational drugs should not be legalized any more than insanity should be legalized. We need more clear thinking people, not a bunch of crack-heads riding around doing wheelies.

oldfogey · 10-07-2004, 10:36 AM

For the record, I assume legalisation includes rules forbidding working and driving under the influence just like alcohol.

ccwilli3 · 10-07-2004, 10:44 AM

Also, I think if legal, the "coolness" factor of drugs will diminish some...

figment · 10-07-2004, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ccwilli3

Also, I think if legal, the "coolness" factor of drugs will diminish some...

like tobacco?

edit: and alchohol?

SuperDave · 10-07-2004, 11:55 AM

Legalize marijuana, what a waste of law enforcement money. Alcohol is far worse in aggression and lack of coordination. If the NFL player Ricky Williams doesn't want to take Paxil because he can't function as a zombie, but would rather use marijuana, then why not. Aside from the pharmaceutical companies not getting a cut in the profit. We (well, the drug companies) can create drugs for every ailment man has (or thinks he has) but we can't lawfully allow someone to purchase marijuana.

BTW, I'd be curious to the overall health of liver due to chronic pharmaceutical intake versus lung damage from smoking the weed.

I personally tried it once, but never inhaled.

ccwilli3 · 10-07-2004, 12:06 PM

I've never smoked pot or done any type of drug like that...

But I have never met a pothead that was aggressive. They might not ever stop talking or stop eating, but they've never wanted to be aggressive to anyone.

legalize it, tax the **** out of it and lower my overall taxes!

sheepofblue · 10-07-2004, 12:11 PM

Decriminalize ALL drugs (the harsher ones like crack and herione should be available under supervision to any fool wanting them). And legalize the less harsh ones.

Do not tax the s### out of them, since more $$ in government means less freedom for me.

It would not cure stupid but it would lower crime.

oldfogey · 10-07-2004, 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sheepofblue

Do not tax the s### out of them, since more $$ in government means less freedom for me.

Sheep, my assumption for these purposes is that government tax take overall remains the same, so increased tax revenues on legalised drugs = lower taxes elsewhere.

luvtolean · 10-07-2004, 12:19 PM

Though I'm not much for taxation, in this case I think it's the perfect solution.

Legalize drugs, tax them to pay for the problems of drug use, and move on. Quit wasting money on the stupid "war on drugs".

I did a speech on pro-legalization in college. I was with a group of very conservative students in a public speaking class so I bought a couple of High Times, cut out pics, did lots of research, and came in looking for a fight.

Someone asked the question I was hoping for, "Are you talking about legalizing pot?"
LTL: "Absolutely. As well as crack cocaine. I mean, goto 7-Eleven and buy it in a pack like Bazooka gum for a buck. If you'll note such and such study..."

I had done so much research, and had so many facts, that was the last question.

BDA116 · 10-07-2004, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by luvtolean

Though I'm not much for taxation, in this case I think it's the perfect solution.

Legalize drugs, tax them to pay for the problems of drug use, and move on. Quit wasting money on the stupid "war on drugs".

I did a speech on pro-legalization in college. I was with a group of very conservative students in a public speaking class so I bought a couple of High Times, cut out pics, did lots of research, and came in looking for a fight.

Someone asked the question I was hoping for, "Are you talking about legalizing pot?"
LTL: "Absolutely. As well as crack cocaine. I mean, goto 7-Eleven and buy it in a pack like Bazooka gum for a buck. If you'll note such and such study..."

I had done so much research, and had so many facts, that was the last question.

I'm with LTL on this one for the most part. I'm not sure about legalizing some of the harsher drugs, but pot could be very easily regulated like alcohol and tobacco.
Would there still be some that skirt the system? Sure, there are those that do it now with alcohol and tobacco. I do think it would lower some crime, and would remove a lot of the "cool factor" so many think they have when smoking pot.
Yes, make it available through liquor stores, tax it more heavily than tobacco, stop wasting money on the "drug war", and watch the tax revenues jump by massive amounts.
Not only will we stop burning money on the war against pot, but we will be making money off all the idiots that smoke it. We would also be generating a whole new legitimate economy with local farmers and hemp materials.

luvtolean · 10-07-2004, 12:33 PM

I am dead serious when I say this, all indications I saw pointed to the main reason the government isn't going to formally legalize pot is that it is so easy to grow. It is called "weed" for a reason. And if everyone grows their own you can't tax it.

Brewing beer takes a lot of skill and work. Growing tobacco isn't easy either. This keeps the average guy from doing this. But pot is.

BTW, it's not necessarily my opinion on the crack thing, I was looking to expand the horizons of a bunch of "holy rollers".

But honestly, I think it's harder to make a rational case against legalization.

luvtolean · 10-07-2004, 12:40 PM

BTW, IMO, marijuana is being "unofficially" legalized here in the states.

Most job apps separate marijuana offenses. Last night I filled out a background check for a buddy trying to get a job with the CHP, and it too separates marijuana from "drugs".

I know engineers who did surveys for government clearances at places like lockheed. They too separate out marijuana offenses from drugs.

BDA116 · 10-07-2004, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by luvtolean

BTW, IMO, marijuana is being "unofficially" legalized here in the states.

Most job apps separate marijuana offenses. Last night I filled out a background check for a buddy trying to get a job with the CHP, and it too separates marijuana from "drugs".

I know engineers who did surveys for government clearances at places like lockheed. They too separate out marijuana offenses from drugs.

All the more reason to sell it through legal channels and make a profit off it.

Chain · 10-07-2004, 12:51 PM

If we decriminalize homicide, I'll bet the murder rate will go down too.

OF COURSE crime will drop if the possession/distribution/manufacturing of heretofore illegal drugs is permitted.

So the question becomes, do we have a truly crime free society if we decriminalize everything?

I guess so . . .

dB · 10-07-2004, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldfogey

OK, let's find out whether the Republicans here are libertarians or conservatives.

I like the way you think, oldfogey.

I'm a libertarian foremost, but fall on the conservative side of the drug issue because I believe it requires a sober and moral population to defend/maintain our liberty (or what's left of it).

That's not to say I make judgements about individuals who smoke a little pot for whatever reasons (and think prosecuting them is a waste of time, at best), but at the same time I'd hate to see recreational drugs marketed to the masses.

BTW, I don't own any guns but wholly support those who do so responsibly, as well as the second amendment of our Consitution (and not for sporting reasons, or even reasons of self-defense). I may buy my first gun and/or join the NRA the day after Kerry is elected.

luvtolean · 10-07-2004, 12:59 PM

Drugs create secondary crime to fund them because they are so costly. People don't go do robberies so they can go murder people.

luvtolean · 10-07-2004, 1:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dB

BTW, I don't own any guns but wholly support those who do so responsibly, as well as the second amendment of our Consitution (and not for sporting reasons, or even reasons of self-defense). I may buy my first gun and/or join the NRA the day after Kerry is elected.

It may very well be your first and last.

dB · 10-07-2004, 1:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by luvtolean

It may very well be your first and last.

Admittedly it would be largely on principle, and too little too late. I've watched CA decline into socialism (largely on the votes of non-natives) but contented myself that a lot of the rest of the country was holding the line. A Kerry victory would be the end of that contentment.

luvtolean · 10-07-2004, 1:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dB

Admittedly it would be largely on principle, and too little too late. I've watched CA decline into socialism (largely on the votes of non-natives) but contented myself that a lot of the rest of the country was holding the line. A Kerry victory would be the end of that contentment.

I'm seriously thinking about buying a .50 cal as my own personal political statement. But the entry fee is steep!

Arnie sure has been pissing me off lately with his new laws...

oldfogey · 10-07-2004, 1:14 PM

At close of day for me, the vote is close to 50:50. I'll be interested to see how the Aussies vote overnight.

deez · 10-07-2004, 1:31 PM

Marijuana isn't legal because it would seriously fubar some drug companies product sales. There are many reasons why it's not legal. I've always found it funny how alcohol is legal, but maryjane is not. Which one kills more each year, contributes to death, etc? It's not hard to figure out.

One thing is for certain, if Dubya is pres, you won't see anything get decriminalized. Last pres. that mentioned maryjane laws needing to be revised was Carter, and he got hell for it.