Should this guy be strung up?

cbr99xx · 12-11-2004, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cowboy1600

What part?

The bait... A seemingly simple question with a hint of other, more controversial, issues pushed to the side.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cowboy1600

Should this guy be strung up?...

Seeing as a lot of you believe that thoses soliders who refused to go on a "suicide mission" should get the book thrown at them, do you think this guy should be court-marshalled?

Getting several nibbles but no bites you throw out another hook...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cowboy1600

If what the soldier said is true does this change any opinions about the last lot that refused the mission? If I remember correctly their greatest concern was the lack of adequate vehicles.

You've already conceded in post #1 that "a lot of you believe that thoses (sp) soliders (sp) who refused to go on a "suicide mission" should get the book thrown at them". It seems to me that you have gone off topic in your own thread in order to gleam a response more to your liking.

Now you're really trying to set the hook... I have no idea how Clinton ended up in a thread asking if a soldier should be punished for asking a question at a meeting set up specifically to hear grievances from soldiers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cowboy1600

You cant blame Clinton for this. Bush has been in power for 4 years. Buch is also the one that ordered troops over there knowing that they are short on equipment. If he was truly concerned maybe he should have held off until they were better equiped

Would anyone here refuse an order if they knew it was a suicide mission?

"Up to 19 members of the 343rd Quartermaster Company were detained at gunpoint for nearly two days after disobeying orders to drive trucks that they said had not been serviced and were not being escorted by armed vehicles to Taji, about 15 miles north of Baghdad, relatives said after speaking to some of the soldiers."

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/artic...MNG0D9B5JS1.DTL

Does this new situation with the solider complaining about the vehicles vindicate these 19 soldiers?

But hey... It's your thread, bait and switch if you like, but if you get called... your cards are already out, all over this thread, for all to see. Bill Dance would be proud.

Cowboy1600 · 12-12-2004, 12:41 AM

i dont ****ing get it. So I should sit here and just nod and agree with everything? Questioning ur opinions means Im fishing? Questions are a good way to harbour discussion? If we all agreed on everything then this forum section would exist. If you dont like me "fishing" theres a simple fix, **** off and dont browse any threads I start. You should know by now Im probably going to ask questions that will make you cry.

Cowboy1600 · 12-12-2004, 12:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cbr99xx

The bait... A seemingly simple question with a hint of other, more controversial, issues pushed to the side.

Getting several nibbles but no bites you throw out another hook...

You've already conceded in post #1 that "a lot of you believe that thoses (sp) soliders (sp) who refused to go on a "suicide mission" should get the book thrown at them". It seems to me that you have gone off topic in you're own thread in order to gleam a response more to your liking.

This story is relevant to the issue of the soldiers that refused that mission seeing as they were complaining of inadequate vehicles and armoured support, and this soldier was asking when their vehicles are going to be bought up to satisfactory standard. Can you not see how the 2 are linked?

Quote:

Now you're really trying to set the hook... I have no idea how Clinton ended up in a thread asking if a soldier should be punished for asking a question at a meeting set up specifically to hear grievances from soldiers.

I didnt bring Clinton into this argument. This really isnt a right/left issue but obviously some people(eg. rocket) cant get over it.

Quote:

But hey... It's your thread, bait and switch if you like, but if you get called... your cards are already out, all over this thread, for all to see. Bill Dance would be proud.

Im not switching. Im asking questions relating to this issue. The US army is very strict on discipline, respect etc, is it not? This question, regardless of who set it up, was pretty clearly designed to put Rumsfeld on the spot, tyr and catch him off guard. Am I incorrect in assuming this could be a little out of line?

bwhip · 12-12-2004, 1:28 AM

Keep Fishing

cbr99xx · 12-12-2004, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cowboy1600

Im not switching. Im asking questions relating to this issue. The US army is very strict on discipline, respect etc, is it not? This question, regardless of who set it up, was pretty clearly designed to put Rumsfeld on the spot, tyr and catch him off guard. Am I incorrect in assuming this could be a little out of line?

I've already given you my thoughts on this subject.

As far as the fishing comments are concerned... I feel as though the whole political forum is nothing more a huge fishing expedition. Politics, religion and personal finance are all issues that usually have strong feelings running just below the surface. A little prick (no pun intended

) is all that is needed to bring these feelings up and flowing. I've seen the best of friends turn on each other when faced with the issues mentioned above.

Fishing... Sure we are… it’s the whole nature of a political conversation. You just seem to be a bit better versed in the ways of angling than others.

firedawgon929 · 12-12-2004, 3:59 PM

Ok, things are getting a little heated. Bottom line is, there is no reason why he should be "strung up". Asking when the vehicles were going to be brought up to standard is not a crime. Now if the soldier had said "I refuse to do my duty until I have the protective equipment I believe I deserve." Then he would be court-marshalled for dereliction of duty and disobeying a direct order.

Rumsfeld probably did not like nor appreciate being put on the spot like that, and I have absolutely no doubt that this particular soldier is feeling the wrath of his superiors ( chain of command ), but legally he did nothing wrong. End of story, bottom line, yada-yada-yada.

- firedawgon929
Senior Airman, USAF

rocket · 12-12-2004, 6:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cowboy1600

i dont ****ing get it.

Well, that about sums it up for me."

"Some people would say 'This glass is half-empty', others would say, 'this glass is half-full'. I'm thinking you're one of the half-empty guys."

Name the movie.

Bacchus · 12-12-2004, 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by firedawgon929

Rumsfeld probably did not like nor appreciate being put on the spot like that,

Bottom, bottom line. And I love it! Cheers to that soldier for speaking his mind (and the truth)!

Cowboy1600 · 12-13-2004, 2:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rocket

Well, that about sums it up for me."

"Some people would say 'This glass is half-empty', others would say, 'this glass is half-full'. I'm thinking you're one of the half-empty guys."

Name the movie.

Not sure of the movie but you couldnt be further from the truth.

ER · 12-13-2004, 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rocket

Name the movie.

Is it too early for flapjacks?

rocket · 12-13-2004, 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ER

Is it too early for flapjacks?

You got it

. Don't drive angry! Don't drive angry!

rocket · 12-13-2004, 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cowboy1600

Not sure of the movie but you couldnt be further from the truth.

Glad to hear that CB.

Now guess the movie.

cbr99xx · 12-13-2004, 10:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rocket

Glad to hear that CB.

Now guess the movie.

Hey I've done time in this thread!!!!

Quote:

When Chekhov saw the long winter, he saw a winter bleak and dark and bereft of hope. Yet we know that winter is just another step in the cycle of life. But standing here among the people of Punxsutawney and basking in the warmth of their hearths and hearts, I couldn't imagine a better fate than a long and lustrous winter.

ER · 12-14-2004, 12:12 PM

Morons...your bus is leaving.

Baketech · 01-03-2005, 9:10 AM

Why no discussion about the latest details of this story....

It appears that the question asked of Rummy was not the soldier's, but rather a question planted by a journalist who pre-arranged that the soldier would be called upon.

* I'm not arguing the validity of the question, but rather the means by which the media becomes the story rather than reporting the story.

rocket · 01-03-2005, 10:25 AM

I mentioned in my second post on this thread.... nobody bit.

Guess that is why I'm still a junior grade Angler.

Can't let facts get in the way of a good argument.

bwhip · 01-03-2005, 2:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baketech

Why no discussion about the latest details of this story....

It appears that the question asked of Rummy was not the soldier's, but rather a question planted by a journalist who pre-arranged that the soldier would be called upon.

* I'm not arguing the validity of the question, but rather the means by which the media becomes the story rather than reporting the story.

Mentioned in my post (#30) above.

Baketech · 01-03-2005, 2:16 PM

I saw the mentions....but there seemed to be no substantive counterpoint from the other side of the fence...

sheepofblue · 01-03-2005, 2:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baketech

Why no discussion about the latest details of this story....

It appears that the question asked of Rummy was not the soldier's, but rather a question planted by a journalist who pre-arranged that the soldier would be called upon.

* I'm not arguing the validity of the question, but rather the means by which the media becomes the story rather than reporting the story.

I don't watch network news, it raises your IQ to hit the off switch.

luvtolean · 01-03-2005, 2:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sheepofblue

I don't watch network news, it raises your IQ to hit the off switch.

I think I said that, word for word, when explaining to my GF last night what I liked least about TV (network news) when I had cable.

Baketech · 01-03-2005, 3:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sheepofblue

I don't watch network news, it raises your IQ to hit the off switch.

I'm not seeing the connection....

cbr99xx · 01-03-2005, 8:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baketech

Why no discussion about the latest details of this story....

It appears that the question asked of Rummy was not the soldier's, but rather a question planted by a journalist who pre-arranged that the soldier would be called upon.

* I'm not arguing the validity of the question, but rather the means by which the media becomes the story rather than reporting the story.

A journalist (IMO) should report the facts, a journalist should not become nor should they force a story.

I've seen the Drudge report on the reporter prompting the soldier's question but I've seen nothing on him being sure he's called upon. I'll take your word for it, but, it kinda flips the story... doesn't it? How/why does someone from Rumsfield's camp make sure he calls on this guy? OR... If someone got duped I bet there was hell to pay.

Baketech · 01-03-2005, 8:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cbr99xx

A journalist (IMO) should report the facts, a journalist should not become nor should they force a story.

I've seen the Drudge report on the reporter prompting the soldier's question but I've seen nothing on him being sure he's called upon. I'll take your word for it, but, it kinda flips the story... doesn't it? How/why does someone from Rumsfield's camp make sure he calls on this guy? OR... If someone got duped I bet there was hell to pay.

I watched the interview on the tube, and the reporter stated that he pointed out questioner to the organizers before the Q&A session...

I don't have a problem with it either, but it should have been disclosed appropriately...