Timetable for Iraq pullout?

Chain · 01-27-2005, 3:52 PM

What do you all think? The sooner the better AFAIC.

Scary. For the first time in my life, I'm reasonably close to agreeing with a Kennedy.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp...raq_kennedy_dc

OTOH, perhaps we're in too deep to pull the pin and haul ass right after the elections. The way I see it is, the country is going to fall into a full blown civil war either way, so why not cut and run? We've gotten Saddam, set up elections, what else is there to do before announcing an exit strategy?

roadrunner954 · 01-27-2005, 4:58 PM

I'm not Anti Bush, but I think we should call it good and let Iraq deal with Iraq.

IMO

Baketech · 01-27-2005, 5:48 PM

How do you set a timetable for an event driven process....

ND4SPD · 01-27-2005, 5:57 PM

Not gonna happen anytime soon. It's a good location for the rest of the mid-east plans which I'm sure he has, and if we pull out we're gonna be hated even more(if that's even possible) for leaving in the "middle of it all"

Chain · 01-27-2005, 9:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baketech

How do you set a timetable for an event driven process....

Again, Saddam is out of power. Elections are to take place in a couple days. There are your events, now it's time to go.

Edit: Oh, and if you're going to tell me we've got to wait around until the country stabilizes and/or until the day an Iraqi security force of sufficient size can be installed, well, I guess we'll be waiting forever. Iraq was a f*cked up, underbelly, fourth world country before... and will be long after we leave.

Bacchus · 01-27-2005, 9:17 PM

Sorry, but, we shoulda never been there in the first place...

Anyone who did not foresee this happening has his/her head in the sand.

Chain · 01-27-2005, 9:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bacchus

Sorry, but, we shoulda never been there in the first place...

Anyone who did not foresee this happening has his/her head in the sand.

I will admit to being on the war bandwagon when it first began. And my support of the troops has been unwavering. However, there comes a time that leaders are oftentimes faced with changing course and -IMO- the time is soon to come.

I predict Bush will find a way to get the hell out of Dodge in a few months or be ready to hand the keys of the White House to the Dems in four years.

sheepofblue · 01-27-2005, 9:24 PM

I predict the elections will go much better than anyone expects and better than the TVs talking heads will admit. Unfortunately some people will get killed though

Once a Kurd/Sunni government starts to form the Shiites will follow and success can start.

I also predict by the next presidential election we will be largely out of Iraq (think out of Japan) but not much before.

I predict the Iraqi people are going to suprise a lot of people with thier successes and scare ^@%^%^ out of thier tyranical neighbors however they will make mistakes and be far from perfect. A lot like us.

PS If I reversed Shiite and Sunni

away but the point and opinion is the same.

Baketech · 01-27-2005, 9:35 PM

I think our people are doing a hell of a job over there....

Quote:

and will be long after we leave.

I think history is going to prove you wrong on that point.....

This is the first administration that has had the balls to stop repeating the same idiotic cycle in the Middle East, and in the end, I think their actions will prove to be the right ones. You praised "changing course", well that's exactly what has happened....we shouldn't drop our support before it's done...

Chain · 01-27-2005, 9:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baketech

I think our people are doing a hell of a job over there....

No disputing that.

Bacchus · 01-27-2005, 9:40 PM

Nor me. Just don't think we should have invaded in the first place. Kudos to all of our brave soldiers!

Baketech · 01-28-2005, 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sheepofblue

I predict the elections will go much better than anyone expects and better than the TVs talking heads will admit. Unfortunately some people will get killed though

Once a Kurd/Sunni government starts to form the Shiites will follow and success can start.

I also predict by the next presidential election we will be largely out of Iraq (think out of Japan) but not much before.

I predict the Iraqi people are going to suprise a lot of people with thier successes and scare ^@%^%^ out of thier tyranical neighbors however they will make mistakes and be far from perfect. A lot like us.

PS If I reversed Shiite and Sunni

away but the point and opinion is the same.

HondaGalToo · 01-28-2005, 10:20 AM

But where is Bin Laden??!!

sheepofblue · 01-28-2005, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HondaGalToo

But where is Bin Laden??!!

hanging with Waldo

bwhip · 01-28-2005, 10:28 AM

My preference obviously would be "the sooner the better," but probably the best answer is it should be up to the Iraqi government to decide once the election is completed. Most reports I've seen indicate that the vast majority of Iraqis want the US out, but if you ask them if they want us out tomorrow they say "well, no." I say let the new Iraqi government create an events-based timetable.

Baketech · 01-28-2005, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HondaGalToo

But where is Bin Laden??!!

That's a parallel problem, and you can bet that many of our hard working gals and guys are working their asses off to solve it...

ccwilli3 · 01-28-2005, 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HondaGalToo

But where is Bin Laden??!!

I'm reading a book called Ghost Wars right now. The more I read, the more I think he's somewhere either in Afghanistan or Pakistan. That border area just provides so many hiding opportunities that it's sickening. It's a good read, I recommend it to everyone.

As for the overall question, I too think the sooner the better. However, not before it's time. We'll know when it's time, and now is not that time IMHO.

I believe still too that as long as we are fighting them there, we'll have little to not heat on us HERE, in the lower 48... All those ****s wanna go there and fight the "infidels", great, thats that many less that'll come here and try to kill my family as they work, shop and live... They greatly underestimated our will as a society to protect what makes America great.

How quickly everyone forgets about 9/11.

oldfogey · 01-28-2005, 12:31 PM

My 2c: the US has established military bases in Iraq and the gulf to replace those in Saudi; those Iraqis with oil in the south and north who will vote in the elections are going to have lots of trouble with those in the middle who won't vote; the Iranians continue to maximise their influence in Iraq.

And, off topic but related:

"Iran/US

Several weeks ago I wrote that the
Iranian issue would be put on the backburner as
far as the US was concerned, at least for several
months. There are a couple possibilities as to
why. One is that an Arrow-2 test (Israel's antimissile
defense system), which took place in California
last month against the Shehab 3 (Iranian
missile system), failed. Another possibility is that
Israel's launch of an Ofeq satellite, an important
link in Israel's surveillance, tracking, and guidance
systems, also failed. It is interesting that during
inauguration week, VP Cheney basically said
other countries may act against Iran without US
approval or even knowledge. There is only one
nation I can think of which has the technological
ability to do so and has been identified by Iran as
an enemy of the Iranian state and which should
be destroyed. That is Israel." - commentator I trust but cannot name.

I think you'll be there for a while yet.

ccwilli3 · 01-28-2005, 12:52 PM

if we allowed them (we being the US, meaning, do whatever-the-hell-u-wnat), israel would wipe the entire region of arabs. Period, end of story.

It's scary, why they don't send a big "F U" to the US and just do it is beyond me... And yeah, I think we'll be there a while too. Iraq is the new germany/south korea, you didn't think we were pulling troops out of germany and the rest of europe to bring them home did you?

We're gonna be there for a while...

slodsm · 01-28-2005, 2:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HondaGalToo

But where is Bin Laden??!!

I would bet all of my money and possesions he is still just outside mogudishou (SP) Somalia. Reason being, we are already in Afghan and Pakisatn area, we are known to be there and if we find him there, there will be no scandal involved, only accolades. In somolia, we are "not" there and therefore without informing their government that we "are" there we cannot be there "legally". If we were to go in there and snag him without (a) informing them of our intentions which will lead to (b) them telling us no and us doing it anyway which will create another front to this already overstretched war, then we are forced to just watch with people who are "not" there. He is safe in Somalia so why leave? I know for a fact he was there 11 months ago and our hands are tied so what else can be done at the moment? Keep bribing or breaking his messengers and keep his assets frozen until he decides to move to where we can snag him without creating another international incident and losing more support in the world by saying we are the US and we can do whatever the **** we want, although I think we are and we should.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ccwilli3

How quickly everyone forgets about 9/11.

Have to agree with you there. Some people forget as soon as their regularly scheduled programming returns.

Baketech · 01-30-2005, 10:19 AM

It looks like they are getting a 60-70% turnout even under the threat of violence??!?!?!

Amazing to say the least, that is some serious courage taking place right there....

I doubt we have ever seen as large of a turnout...especially in our first election....

bwhip · 01-30-2005, 10:47 AM

Thank God the violence has been far less than predicted. Looks like the US and Iraqi forces did a great job of prevention, especially by banning all vehicular traffic other than government vehicles. It's awesome to see Iraqis interviewed that are so excited about the opportunity to vote, saying "it's the greatest day in [their] life."