Patriot Act Redux

CBRVFR · 12-16-2005, 1:39 PM

Quote:

The Senate on Friday rejected attempts to reauthorize several provisions of the USA Patriot Act as infringing too much on Americans' privacy, dealing a major defeat to President Bush and Republican leaders. In a crucial vote Friday morning as Congress raced toward adjournment, the bill's Senate supporters were not able to garner the 60 votes necessary to overcome a threatened filibuster by Sens. Russ Feingold, D-Wis., and Larry Craig, R-Idaho, and their allies. The final vote was 52-47

http://www.breitbart.com/news/2005/12/16/D8EHFJI82.html

*Mo Noyz* · 12-16-2005, 7:21 PM

The fillibuster is definitely on!

jaim · 12-17-2005, 5:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CBRVFR

http://www.breitbart.com/news/2005/12/16/D8EHFJI82.html

It wasn't passed but for the wrong reasons. But I will take it anyways.

luvtolean · 12-20-2005, 12:50 PM

This is looking REAL good. We'll see if they can keep it filibustered until the provisions expire on the 31st.

I haven't been so happy about a political event in a long time.

Bush and the some of the republican remarks have made me really sad. I will be voting more demo next go around.

*Mo Noyz* · 12-20-2005, 12:53 PM

They just might.

Anybody else been following the Senate debates on C-Span2?

I'm a hardcore C-Span junkie.

luvtolean · 12-20-2005, 12:54 PM

No cable, but I'd really like to see that.

*Mo Noyz* · 12-20-2005, 1:01 PM

Oh man!!!

You don't know what you're missing!

Baketech · 12-20-2005, 1:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by luvtolean

This is looking REAL good. We'll see if they can keep it filibustered until the provisions expire on the 31st.

I haven't been so happy about a political event in a long time.

Bush and the some of the republican remarks have made me really sad. I will be voting more demo next go around.

Not sure why you would feel sad...this is how the system is supposed to work isn't it...

Not sure how you can predict your future voting either...

I never know who I will vote for until I see the candidates...

*Mo Noyz* · 12-20-2005, 1:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baketech

Not sure how you can predict your future voting either...

I never know who I will vote for until I see the candidates...

I found that particular comment rather curious as well.

Very reactionary. Not too unlike the Democratic party at this time.

luvtolean · 12-20-2005, 1:10 PM

How can I predict it?

Simple, pretty much all fo the Republicans voted for it on the party line. If the republican party line has been decided to promote the Patriot Act, I will vote elsewhere.

When I say sad, I'm talking about the bullshit threats that were made. We have Bush indirectly making threats without the Patriot Act we're going to get nuked.

We have republican senators saying they'll make the democrats pay at the polls for not renewing the provision!

Pay? Hell. Vote with them? Damn straight. That's where my statement originated from.

luvtolean · 12-20-2005, 1:16 PM

Found the quote that led me to my "reactionary" reaction.

Quote:

If the Patriot Act provisions expire, Republicans say they will place the blame on Democrats in next year's midterm elections. "In the war on terror, we cannot afford to be without these vital tools for a single moment," White House press secretary Scott McClellan said. "The time for Democrats to stop standing in the way has come."

Baketech · 12-20-2005, 1:21 PM

How is that any different than the rhetoric that's been coming from the other side of the aisle...

Edit:
Yessss..... CSPAN rocks...

luvtolean · 12-20-2005, 1:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baketech

How is that any different than the rhetoric that's been coming from the other side of the aisle...

Not saying it is, but I happen to agree with the democrats on this issue, and to me it is a very important one. I'm saying I don't forgive the Republican party for this, and it will make me lean away at the next election.

Baketech · 12-20-2005, 1:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by luvtolean

Not saying it is, but I happen to agree with the democrats on this issue, and to me it is a very important one. I'm saying I don't forgive the Republican party for this, and it will make me lean away at the next election.

If it's so important, then how can you forgive the Democrats that did not disclose it immediately....

luvtolean · 12-20-2005, 1:30 PM

We're talking party line type leanings. Not individuals. Of course I'll still look at the person.

There are several Republican senators I'd love to vote for in the next election, but they're in places like NH. And I still can't stand Feinstein, no matter how she voted.

BDA116 · 12-20-2005, 2:10 PM

I'm curious which exact parts of the Act are so reprehensible to just trash the whole thing?
What exact portions of the Act are the problems?
I don't know it inside and out and am just asking the question, but for the most part the Patriot Act (which is a dumb acronym, they should have named it differently so it's acronym was different) just amends and brings together a whole mess of other Acts that were long implemented and needed to be revised.
It also has a lot of positives in it like border protection enhancements, and providing for families of Public Safety Officers that are victims of terror acts.

I know that there are things in there that can expire, but I like the idea of revisiting certain items and rewriting them rather than trashing it and having none of the previous Acts or anything it amended or replaced in effect.

*Mo Noyz* · 12-20-2005, 2:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BDA

I know that there are things in there that can expire, but I like the idea of revisiting certain items and rewriting them rather than trashing it and having none of the previous Acts or anything it amended or replaced in effect.

Which is exactly what the Democrats in the Senate are saying.

Debbie Stabenow D-Michigan said it best this morning. Extend it, don't end it.

BDA116 · 12-20-2005, 2:31 PM

Yeah, vote to give it six months with specific wording as to gaining a broader understanding of things that need to be reworded.
Then get to work on making a better version of these things to vote on in six months.
Drop the bickering and get it fixed instead.
Question is, will they actually work on it rather than bicker, whine and trump it up in the media during that time?

luvtolean · 12-20-2005, 2:35 PM

Nobody is trying to trash it. They are filibustering the extension of several pieces of it. Not the whole thing.

Feingold himself has said that it's not acceptable in current form, but needs to be re-written to include provisions for people to have some rights.

That's good. The Patriot Act was a very emotional law to begin with. Total overreaction.

Now it's time to fix that.

And for God and Allah's sake, rename the ****er.

BDA116 · 12-20-2005, 2:48 PM

Yeah, the actual name, "Uniting and Strengthening America by Providing Appropriate Tools Required to Intercept and Obstruct Terrorism" isn't a whole ton better than the acronym.

*Mo Noyz* · 12-20-2005, 3:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BDA116

Yeah, vote to give it six months with specific wording as to gaining a broader understanding of things that need to be reworded.
Then get to work on making a better version of these things to vote on in six months.
Drop the bickering and get it fixed instead.
Question is, will they actually work on it rather than bicker, whine and trump it up in the media during that time?

3 months, actually.

And I agree with the Feingold/Sununu contingent. The PA needs to be fully revisited.

There were too many new provisions written into it giving the government even more power than before.

I support the filibuster. Every American should. Hopefully the Republicans will concede and vote for the extention.

luvtolean · 12-21-2005, 10:31 PM

Way to keep us safe Herr Dept of Gestapo...I mean Homeland Security.

Here you go, monitoring your library. Check out Mao's Little Red Book and the suits come say hi and put you on a list.

http://www.southcoasttoday.com/daily...5/a09lo650.htm

So rich, a paper in a class about totalitarian and fascist governments gets the US government knocking your door.

But you know, only people who do bad things should have fears of giving up your Constitutional rights.

Baketech · 12-21-2005, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by luvtolean

Way to keep us safe Herr Dept of Gestapo...I mean Homeland Security.

Here you go, monitoring your library. Check out Mao's Little Red Book and the suits come say hi and put you on a list.

http://www.southcoasttoday.com/daily...5/a09lo650.htm

So rich, a paper in a class about totalitarian and fascist governments gets the US government knocking your door.

Interesting fairy tale....but I can't seem to confirm it with another source.

Anyone...