[Custom900]

http://www.darlugo.com/?id=387

This shows some of Bush's best moments.

[esoteric]

You know we could probably get him a 1/2 hour special some weeknight in trade for getting someone useful in office. I'll bet the vote would pass...

[Custom900]

I'm all for Bush - really. I can't say that I agree with everything he has done, but I can also say that I wouldn't agree 100% with anyone in office. I do know that he was better than any other candidate that we had to choose from.

I'm wondering who's really going to be up for the 2008 polls. If it's the people I think it's going to be we are in serious trouble.

[Mo Noyz]

And who would that be?

[phobiaphobe]

Originally Posted by Mo Noyz

And who would that be?

Chuck Norris.

[Custom900]

Originally Posted by phobiaphobe

Chuck Norris.

Luckily it cannot be Phobe.



My biggest concern is first and foremost Hillary Clinton. I don't think she would get elected, but if she did I see nothing but trouble. (That's bringing Whitewater into play all over again)

There are several others as well, but I don't feel like typing the names out. Al Gore could run again too - another bad decision.

[Mo Noyz]

You don't feel like typing the names out?

Alright.........

If you ever do feel like it, I'm interested in seeing your predictions.

[navydevildoc]

Originally Posted by Custom900

Luckily it cannot be Phobe.



My biggest concern is first and foremost Hillary Clinton. I don't think she would get elected, but if she did I see nothing but trouble. (That's bringing Whitewater into play all over again)

There are several others as well, but I don't feel like typing the names out. Al Gore could run again too - another bad decision.

I also don't think Hillary is electable, and I think the DNC is smart enough not to run her. Don't discount her as a VP candidate however.

Regarding Whitewater... Ken Starr and a legion of lawyers couldn't find anything wrong in the Whitewater investigation after years of poring over documents. Call it dirty business, but it wasn't illegal apparently.

I think Rudy Guliani is waiting in the wings to snag the GOP nomination. As far as what the Dems can come up with... if not Barak Obama (is he even old enough?) it will be a no-name governor much like what Bill Clinton did. The good thing that the Democrats have with Hillary is that she is running interference. The press and the right-wing attack machine can focus on her pretty much exclusively. Just a note about the "attack machine" comment... don't get your panties in a bunch; the liberals have one too.

I really wanted General Clark to get at least on the ticket last time around, maybe this time he will have greater luck. I would really like to see a career military guy get in the office again. One that doesn't have shady records or questionable awards.

[Mo Noyz]

I don't think Obama would throw his hat in the ring. Not this time, anyway. Ford might, but not Obama.

Hillary will never get the nom. She'll run, but she won't get the nom. Perhaps a VP nod, but that's even a stretch, IMO.

Clark will definitely run again. But this time I think it will be legit. He would definitely be an interesting underdgo to watch out for.

Kerry, Edwards, and Gore will all run as well. But they'll all do worse than they previously did.

But my darkhorse remains Russ Feingold. He's starting to gain some steam in the public eye. His stance against the automatic renewal of the PA gained him a lot of attention. His call to censure President Bush wasn't very well timed, but his name is starting to slowly creep toward household level.



Guiliani doesn't stand a snow balls chance in hell. He is too socially liberal to fly with the GOP. Though he may not be a bad Veep choice.

Kenny Mehlman has anounced that he is currently raising lots-o-jack for Senator McCain's campaign. Interesting, but possibly suicide for the GOP. McCain is not very well liked by many on the right.

I wouldn't be surprised to see an Allen/Romney ticket. That would be the most likely bet at this point. The only downfall there being that Romney is seen by many as a New England liberal.

And I hate to say it, but more and more everyday I'm seeing Frist as being the darkhorse on the Republican side.

'08 will indeed be interesting. Anytime you don't have an incumbant running it's interesting. I'm really looking foward to it.

But that's mostly because I'm an extreme political nerd.

[Custom900]

And out of every single name you posted not a single one is worth the time it would take to vote.

I'm not sure who would be a good President at this time, but I can't see a single one of those people being the right one for the job.

[Mo Noyz]

I disagree.

I think there are some good names there on both sides.

Feingold and Ford are both highly intelligent and hard working.

McCain is a stand up guy who is smart and very well balanced in his political philosophy.

Allen is well liked and from everything I've seen and read about him, very hard-nosed and intelligent.

[navydevildoc]

Originally Posted by Mo Noyz

Clark will definitely run again. But this time I think it will be legit. He would definitely be an interesting underdgo to watch out for.

Kerry, Edwards, and Gore will all run as well. But they'll all do worse than they previously did.

But my darkhorse remains Russ Feingold. He's starting to gain some steam in the public eye. His stance against the automatic renewal of the PA gained him a lot of attention. His call to censure President Bush wasn't very well timed, but his name is starting to slowly creep toward household level.

Yeah, the WesPAC has been beating the drum more and more over the last few months, so I wouldn't discount another run by Clark.

I agree with Kerry, Edwards, and Gore. Edwards might get some steam going. I saw him speak a long time ago when I lived in NC. Nice enough guy, but not sure about being president.

Feingold could very well have my vote. Like most people, he popped onto my radar with the PA renewal. I think it comes down to who the VP is, and who the GOP produces.

Originally Posted by Mo Noyz

Giuliani doesn't stand a snow balls chance in hell. He is too socially liberal to fly with the GOP. Though he may not be a bad Veep choice.

Kenny Mehlman has anounced that he is currently raising lots-o-jack for Senator McCain's campaign. Interesting, but possibly suicide for the GOP. McCain is not very well liked by many on the right.

And I hate to say it, but more and more everyday I'm seeing Frist as being the darkhorse on the Republican side.

Unfortunately, Giuliani is what I think this country needs... a socially liberal, yet fiscal conservative guy who can get things done in a crisis. To bad the far right wing will never let it happen.

Good lord... PLEASE do not even mention Sen. Frist. That guy scares me, and I think he will scare many other people too. But, for the reasons that Mayor Giuliani was not an acceptable candidate to the right wing, this guy has it in spades.

Originally Posted by Mo Noyz

'08 will indeed be interesting. Anytime you don't have an incumbant running it's interesting. I'm really looking foward to it.

Yup... its gonna be interesting to see how our predictions hold out!

[Mo Noyz]

Originally Posted by ndDoc

Feingold could very well have my vote.

Mine too. Of all the candidates on either saide, he is the one who has impressed me the most over the years. He hasn't presented many bills, but he knows his stuff and usually ends up as a leading voice on the Dems side. The way he conducted himself during the Roberts and Alito hearings was stellar as well.

Edwards, to me, is like Romney on the Republican side. Good looking guy, engaging speaker, but doesn't really seem to have a lot to offer as President. And like Romney, I think Edwards would make an ideal veep.

And I agree with you entirely about both Frist and Guiliani. The Republican party has been somewhat hijacked by the far right, or by the neocons. Guys like Guiliani and McCain would be so ideal to restore a bit of moderation to the party.

But Frist is the guy who can move the base. It's unfortunate. But I think the Republican party will have to suffer a series of major losses in order for it to reform itself.

[SuperDave]

It just doesn't matter. America is and has been run by corporations.

Republican or Democrat, it just won't matter.

Corporations will pick the next puppet to keep making everyone richer in the Whitehouse, Congress, etc.

I'm sure the lobbyist are already scurrying like roaches to line up their next "leader", with "campaign donations".
Oil
Electric
Pharmaceutical
Insurance Companies
Banks
Foreign Interest Groups
Unions/Auto Manufactures

To still believe this is still a country "by the people, for the people" is naive.

Every once in a while the American public gets fed up and considers men like Perot, and Nader, except they realize corporations and Congress are so strong, they would never get support to change anything.

So, does it really matter? The worst that can happen is that their puppet puts us in a rediculous war.

[ND4SPD]

Originally Posted by navydevildoc

I would really like to see a career military guy get in the office again. One that doesn't have shady records or questionable awards.

It'd be nice to see a prez that doesn't dismantle our military, but builds it up.

I would really like to see Giuliani as well.

[QuikMike]

Originally Posted by SuperDave

It just doesn't matter. America is and has been run by corporations.

Republican or Democrat, it just won't matter.

Corporations will pick the next puppet to keep making everyone richer in the Whitehouse, Congress, etc.

I'm sure the lobbyist are already scurrying like roaches to line up their next "leader", with "campaign donations".
Oil
Electric
Pharmaceutical
Insurance Companies
Banks
Foreign Interest Groups
Unions/Auto Manufactures

To still believe this is still a country "by the people, for the people" is naive.

Every once in a while the American public gets fed up and considers men like Perot, and Nader, except they realize corporations and Congress are so strong, they would never get support to change anything.

So, does it really matter? The worst that can happen is that their puppet puts us in a rediculous war.

[luvtolean]

Originally Posted by SuperDave

It just doesn't matter. America is and has been run by corporations.

Republican or Democrat, it just won't matter.

Corporations will pick the next puppet to keep making everyone richer in the Whitehouse, Congress, etc.

I'm sure the lobbyist are already scurrying like roaches to line up their next "leader", with "campaign donations".
Oil
Electric
Pharmaceutical
Insurance Companies
Banks
Foreign Interest Groups
Unions/Auto Manufactures

To still believe this is still a country "by the people, for the people" is naive.

Every once in a while the American public gets fed up and considers men like Perot, and Nader, except they realize corporations and Congress are so strong, they would never get support to change anything.

So, does it really matter? The worst that can happen is that their puppet puts us in a rediculous war.

I'm glad I don't live in a world that pessimistic.

Of all the people that have managed to elevate their name in politics recently, without doing enough research, I'd vote Feingold. The only voice of reason and person fighting my loss of rights in this disgusting political atmosphere Bush and co have created.

[smoothrideronli]

Originally Posted by luvtolean

I'm glad I don't live in a world that pessimistic.

Of all the people that have managed to elevate their name in politics recently, without doing enough research, I'd vote Feingold. The only voice of reason and person fighting my loss of rights in this disgusting political atmosphere Bush and co have created.

[SuperDave]

Originally Posted by luvtolean

I'm glad I don't live in a world that pessimistic.

It's called reality. Do you really think anyone is going to start reversing oil company mergers, telecommunication mergers (the more things change, the more they remain the same - AT&T), is anyone going to really reduce our oil dependancy - or make the merged oil kings stop raping the public? Or stop the HUGE pharmaceutical companies from dictating outrageous prescription prices and stopping all generic equivalents with high priced law firms?
You are dreaming. Pessimistic? It's freaking sad, but it's reality.

Originally Posted by luvtolean

Of all the people that have managed to elevate their name in politics recently, without doing enough research, I'd vote Feingold. The only voice of reason and person fighting my loss of rights in this disgusting political atmosphere Bush and co have created.

Whoever has the most power will run a smear campaign and will damage/discredit the other opponent to where the public is totally frustrated with mud-slinging and they won't know what's truth and what's fiction, oh, and they'll be using our tax money to fund it.

The best you'll get (throw the dog a bone) is maybe a small change to one of our privacy issues, and the President will have honored his campaign promise and it's back to corporation payback. Meanwhile, your taxes will rise, utilities will increase, gas will increase, health insurance will increase with less and less coverage, retirement will become a household joke, education cost will increase, outsourcing will continue to increase...tell me when to stop...the rich will get richer and richer and the middle class will keep sliding down. 1/3 of your entire paycheck will go to health insurance, the other 2/3 will finance your auto/insurance, gas and electric utilities, your property taxes, etc.

[luvtolean]

SuperDave, that is not my reality.

Maybe your reality, but not mine, nor many other people's.

I can give you legions of examples where government blasts corporations. The break ups of Ma Bell, US Steel...history is full of the US gov't breaking up large corps. I can assure you, these corps did not want this to happen.

Do large corporations give lots of power to small groups of people? Yes.

[SuperDave]

Originally Posted by luvtolean

I can give you legions of examples where government blasts corporations. The break ups of Ma Bell.

On January 8th, 1982 AT&T signed a Consent Decree with the U.S. Department of Justice, stipulating that on midnight December 30th 1983, AT&T would divest itself of its 22 telephone operating companies. According to the terms of the Divestitur, those 22 operating Bell companies would be formed into seven regional holding companies of roughly equal size. Terms of the Divestiture placed business restrictions on AT&T and the BOCs.

Those restrictions were threefold: The bOCs weren't allowed into long distance, equipment manufacturing, or information services. AT&T wasn't allowed into local telecommunications (i.e. to compete with the BOCs).

Does this sound familar? Are you familar with this year's SBC and AT&T merge? Do you know how big SBC became before merging with AT&T? Like I said, the more things change...the more they stay the same.

[BDA116]

Current U.S. tax laws are making big business go overseas, period. Current labor practises with unions, etc. are making U.S. businesses go foreign as well, period.
The government does not cowtow to "big business" like all you tin hat society type like to believe (I also love how you always put "big" in front of anything you deem evil).
Aside from that, is the country and economy better driven by big successful, profitable business or homeless pot-smoking hippies?

And I would vote for Romney in a heartbeat.

[luvtolean]

Originally Posted by SuperDave

On January 8th, 1982 AT&T signed a Consent Decree with the U.S. Department of Justice, stipulating that on midnight December 30th 1983, AT&T would divest itself of its 22 telephone operating companies. According to the terms of the Divestitur, those 22 operating Bell companies would be formed into seven regional holding companies of roughly equal size. Terms of the Divestiture placed business restrictions on AT&T and the BOCs.

Those restrictions were threefold: The bOCs weren't allowed into long distance, equipment manufacturing, or information services. AT&T wasn't allowed into local telecommunications (i.e. to compete with the BOCs).

Does this sound familar? Are you familar with this year's SBC and AT&T merge? Do you know how big SBC became before merging with AT&T? Like I said, the more things change...the more they stay the same.

And if it becomes bothersome for any reason, they will again be broken up.

People say "big business" like it's a dirty word.

Big business is very important for the country, the trouble is finding the right balance between the people (ideally represented by the government) and biz.

The beauty of our system is that it is not run by big corporations, and they can make independant decisions. And if they make bad or good changes, they're just a bill away from being fixed.