For Gun Owners

DragonRider · 10-22-2008, 12:04 PM

Here is an interesting article:

NRA-ILA :: Legislation

NOBAMA 08 if you want to keep your firearms and right to carry them!

FB1000inPA · 10-22-2008, 12:40 PM

Good luck. If he takes them all I will build myself a new one.

DragonRider · 10-22-2008, 2:57 PM

Hmmm...makes me wonder what exactly would happen if they (govt) said they were seizing all civilian weapons...now that is a scary picture!!

FB1000inPA · 10-22-2008, 3:05 PM

It will never happen. Any .gov that attempts this will be shut down in weeks.

bettingpython · 10-22-2008, 3:15 PM

What guns???? I got hard up for cash had to sell em all except this POS jennings .25.....here you go.

DragonRider · 10-22-2008, 3:35 PM

Let's hope not.

What I mean by that is, I hope they don't come to my house....at least not 1st.

ALthough it would be easy to say, Guns...what guns...It would be really hard to do that with a 12 gauge pointed out the door!!

SuperDucky9 · 10-22-2008, 6:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dr256

T
IF Obama gets in, how far do you really think he'll get with any new gun laws?

Not far... Id say about as far as my door if he tries to take my guns...if he falls backwards...

bjay51d · 10-22-2008, 10:29 PM

I'm curious,how many of you second amendment guys voted for GW?

vertical954rr · 10-23-2008, 12:02 AM

NoBama! He's a gun grabbin, black power marxist.. the thought of that traitor having the power of executive order & a democratic congress & senate to pass sweeping communist laws is a scary thought for this nation. He is a threat to the national security of this free republic, period.

Everything you need to know about Obama can be found here:

The Obama File

latest news:

The Obama File -- Latest News

dbierman · 10-23-2008, 12:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FB1000inPA

It will never happen. Any .gov that attempts this will be shut down in weeks.

Tell that to these guys. CNN - Strict new gun law in Britain - September 30, 1997

Go ahead and vote for Obama and see all your constitutional rights trampled on. He has no allegiance to this country.

dr256 · 10-23-2008, 5:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dbierman

Tell that to these guys. CNN - Strict new gun law in Britain - September 30, 1997

Go ahead and vote for Obama and see all your constitutional rights trampled on. He has no allegiance to this country.

Its somewhat different in the UK as we don't have a second amendment type policy written into our statute. In fact we don't even have a written constitution so there's no convention for these sorts of laws.

The Dunblane incident appalled our entire nation. And while, what is effectively a minority of gun owners in the UK, were upset about the legislation, the vast majority approve and would, and do, support what is a total ban on civilians owning guns.

stoney0422 · 10-23-2008, 5:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bjay51d

I'm curious,how many of you second amendment guys voted for GW?

I did were u trying to say this is a bad thing? I am not going to try to defend everything he has done by any means but he was and still is better than kerry any day. And if u are still thinking about Obama because 2nd ammendment isnt that important to you then check out his immigration policy!

FB1000inPA · 10-23-2008, 9:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dbierman

Tell that to these guys. CNN - Strict new gun law in Britain - September 30, 1997

Go ahead and vote for Obama and see all your constitutional rights trampled on. He has no allegiance to this country.

Yes, I understand what you are trying to say but the British are more sheeply than the Americans and only make movies about anarchy etc. (look

at my signature) but don't rise up and fight the .gov if necessary. Americans do and will.

dr256 · 10-23-2008, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FB1000inPA

Yes, I understand what you are trying to say but the British are more sheeply than the Americans and only make movies about anarchy etc. (look

at my signature) but don't rise up and fight the .gov if necessary. Americans do and will.

What a crock of sh*t.

FB1000inPA · 10-23-2008, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dr256

What a crock of sh*t.

OK, so who can easier buy weapons? Who can easier store them at home? Who can easier get a concealed permit? Who can easier transport them? Who has a law that grants citizens to bare arms?

It ain't Great Britain.

dr256 · 10-23-2008, 1:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FB1000inPA

OK, so who can easier buy weapons? Who can easier store them at home? Who can easier get a concealed permit? Who can easier transport them? Who has a law that grants citizens to bare arms?

It ain't Great Britain.

We don't rise up over weapons because we don't want them. Simple.

And lets face americans generally sit behind lobby groups rather than actually rising up and fighting themselves.

Public protest has been far more prevalent in the UK than America. 2,000,000 turned out on the streets of London against the war on Iraq. Our may day marches have resulting in running battles with the police on almost a yearly basis. The pole tax riots resulted in millions of pounds of damage to central London. The battle of the bean field saw whole families fighting for their right to live their chosen way of life. We fought the cops with sticks on Salisbury plain....this is just the last decade and these are real fights, with fists and sticks, against the state and their policies.

Different issues yes, but we have a much longer and more virulent history of public unrest than the American people.

Grover130 · 10-23-2008, 1:38 PM

Birds of a feather!

dr256 · 10-23-2008, 1:59 PM

Grover - I think you'll find it was your very own government that initially funded Osama to go up against the Russians. Then of course they funded Saddam against Iran.

And now they want to say Obama is the one connected to terrorists?

Grover130 · 10-23-2008, 2:05 PM

The government is corrupt. I can't deny that one basic fact.

dr256 · 10-23-2008, 2:16 PM

Agreed Grover.
Enjoy your day. Home time in the UK and I can feel the scenic route coming on despite the weather.

Our governments are corrupt but inside my Gortex my heart is still warm!

Best wishes

bjay51d · 10-23-2008, 3:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stoney0422

I did were u trying to say this is a bad thing? I am not going to try to defend everything he has done by any means but he was and still is better than kerry any day. And if u are still thinking about Obama because 2nd ammendment isnt that important to you then check out his immigration policy!

I think Bush has the lowest approval rating of any president in history.He took reign of the country with a surplus of cash from clinton.Now we owe trillions....
And what was his immagration policy? f%ck up the country enough the mexicans will stay home.

FB1000inPA · 10-23-2008, 3:20 PM

Not so fast. The reason we had a surplus was because the Clinctons raised the taxes.

dbierman · 10-23-2008, 3:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FB1000inPA

Yes, I understand what you are trying to say but the British are more sheeply than the Americans and only make movies about anarchy etc. (look

at my signature) but don't rise up and fight the .gov if necessary. Americans do and will.

I disagree. The British are no more sheeply than any other country. How long has it been since "Americans" stood up and fought the government? Over 200 years? This country will have to go a lot further into the shitter before we stand up as "Americans" and fight to get our country back.

Quote:

Originally Posted by FB1000inPA

OK, so who can easier buy weapons? Who can easier store them at home? Who can easier get a concealed permit? Who can easier transport them? Who has a law that grants citizens to bare arms?

It ain't Great Britain.

The Brits were for the most part in agreement about the gun ban. I think there's a lot of them out there now that wish they hadn't. I may be wrong about it though because I listen to conservative radio and tv shows that tend to defend 2nd ammendment rights and this is what they will want to portray.

bettingpython · 10-23-2008, 3:52 PM

Brits were sold a bill of goods on gun bans years ago, what would you need something like that for? Look at reason man all you need is a birding gun and maybe a small game rifle. The path of reasonable restrictions is what led them down the primrose path of all out gun bans.

It's something in the air over their, get one over here and take em to the range teach em too shoot and they suddenly realize all the fun they have missed out on.

I taught one of my wifes students to shoot, she's becoming more and more conservative and politically informed everyday.

FB1000inPA · 10-23-2008, 4:05 PM

OK, I let you in on a little secret. My uncle wrote with two other guys the one and only handbook for German weapon laws. This book is use everywhere to interpret the German gun laws. For me he is the only authority when it comes to German laws. Besides that he knows the laws of most European countries as well.

I just recently saw him in person and we discussed the German, European, and American laws and he stated that European laws in general are a crock of sh!t. It has no success in disarming criminals but takes away the means that lawabiting citizens can protect themselves. In general he said that the laws went way to far.
Instead of focusing on disarming legal gun owners the government needs to step up and better control the illegal gun trafficking. He told me it is easier to buy a full auto AK in Munich than some pot.
When we talked about the US he told me that he sees a very strong attempt to shift the laws to allign them to European laws.
We also compared the crime rates, murders by a firearms, etc statistics and there is no corelation between stricter firearms control and the number of crimes - neither in Europe nor in the USA.

I call the whole democratic attempt to limit firearms in the US BS.

bjay51d · 10-23-2008, 4:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FB1000inPA

Not so fast. The reason we had a surplus was because the Clinctons raised the taxes.

Ok i rather pay a few dollars more for programs that will help our people....Its better than going bankrupt liberating a country that doesnt even want us there...**** even with the higher taxes everyone was making money.

Surffrog · 10-24-2008, 5:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dbierman

The Brits were for the most part in agreement about the gun ban. I think there's a lot of them out there now that wish they hadn't. I may be wrong about it though because I listen to conservative radio and tv shows that tend to defend 2nd ammendment rights and this is what they will want to portray.

Quite true, Dbeirman, though you may find attitudes changing as more and more crimes are committed using illegal weapons smuggled in by the East Europeans.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bettingpython

Brits were sold a bill of goods on gun bans years ago, what would you need something like that for? Look at reason man all you need is a birding gun and maybe a small game rifle. The path of reasonable restrictions is what led them down the primrose path of all out gun bans.

It's something in the air over their, get one over here and take em to the range teach em too shoot and they suddenly realize all the fun they have missed out on.

While what you say is true, BP, it does overlook that fact that Britain has never been a gun culture. While we did have gun clubs (I for one enjoyed shooting a target), the members accounted for such a small portion of the population. In general (me not included), the Brits don't want guns.

Btw, BP, you would love my old man. Any spare time he has available is spent in the US at a gun club

dr256 · 10-24-2008, 6:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FB1000inPA

he stated that European laws in general are a crock of sh!t. It has no success in disarming criminals but takes away the means that lawabiting citizens can protect themselves.

Okay let's look at the figures:

In America for every hundred citizens there are 90 guns. In the the UK there are 5.7. (2007) This relates to 39% (1993) of households owning guns in the US and 4.7% of household in the UK.(1992)

In America per 100,000 population there were 14.05 firearms related deaths, in the UK there were .57 (1997 - the latest figures I could find and including homicide, suicide and accidental deaths)

Looks to me like our guns laws are having more success than yours!

bettingpython · 10-24-2008, 8:14 AM

We went through 10 years of restrictions and tighter gun laws and the numbers have not changed. Even with mandatory criminal records firearms crimes are being committed by.....you guessed it criminals.

Guns make it easier to off ones self but how about total suicides per 100,000 for each country? Not just firearms suicides.

Also California the state with some of the most Draconian gun laws in effect is seeing even higher crime rates, not necessarily gun violence but attacks and home invasions, in states that have de restricted gun control laws and enacted CCW laws the crime rate doesn't change but it's focus changes there are fewer assaults and home invasions. Legal usage of a firearm for defense that kills someone falls in the homicide category, so of the homicide breakdown what percentage of those were ruled justifiable. Last but not least the WHO krueger study also included all gun related incidents by law enforcement officers in the line of duty.

BBC News | UK | Handgun crime 'up' despite ban

28 gun crimes committed in UK every day - Telegraph

And again criminals have guns, citizens don't seems to be working really well.

dbierman · 10-24-2008, 9:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dr256

Okay let's look at the figures:

In America for every hundred citizens there are 90 guns. In the the UK there are 5.7. (2007) This relates to 39% (1993) of households owning guns in the US and 4.7% of household in the UK.(1992)

In America per 100,000 population there were 14.05 firearms related deaths, in the UK there were .57 (1997 - the latest figures I could find and including homicide, suicide and accidental deaths)

Looks to me like our guns laws are having more success than yours!

I myself don't consider gangbanger on gangbanger as part of the equation. If you take out those numbers I assure our numbers would be less than yours. Reason being the legitimate gun owners are not attacked nearly as often by these criminals. You guys don't have the gangbanger problem we have here.