[cherd]

It’s not a matter of who is right and who is wrong, they are both wrong. The state of modern Israel was created by annexing a chunk of land that belonged to the Palestinians. The Palestinians have every right to be angry about this, among other things (crusades, etc.). Jewish Israelites do seem to try to exist as a productive, semi-harmonious society, however, this is a luxury afforded them due to support of outside interests (mainly the US). Some extremist Palestinian groups are hell-bent on doing something about these injustices so, in large part due to limited resources, they resort to despicable terrorist methods. Israel should have every right to defend itself, but it is debatable as to whether or not they should even be there in the first place.

As a response to this situation, the rest of the world sits around and contemplates reasonable approaches to solving the problem. But, the root of the problem is that both groups of people believe that they have divine right to this chunk of land based on the will of some supernatural deity. Trying to come up with a reasonable solution is a futile approach because neither of these groups of people are interested in reason! The basic premise of the conflict is firmly rooted in non-reason, based on beliefs held in a state of ignorance! When the rest of the world acknowledges or otherwise participates in the conflict it only serves to condone and perpetuate ignorance. Worse yet, this conflict of stupidity could very possibly escalate into a world war. It’s sad that a region full of antiquated cultures fighting over something so fundamentally moronic could ultimately destroy all societies as we know them.

The best course of action that the rest of us can take is to ignore them. The indescribably sad reality is that many innocent people on both sides have, are, and will continue to suffer due to this situation. However, that does not change the reality that this conflict will not stop until one group defeats the other, or reason eventually prevails (we all know this will not occur). With this being the case, quite frankly, I am tired of hearing about it.

[Surffrog]

Originally Posted by cherd

It’s not a matter of who is right and who is wrong, they are both wrong. The state of modern Israel was created by annexing a chunk of land that belonged to the Palestinians. The Palestinians have every right to be angry about this, among other things (crusades, etc.). Jewish Israelites do seem to try to exist as a productive, semi-harmonious society, however, this is a luxury afforded them due to support of outside interests (mainly the US). Some extremist Palestinian groups are hell-bent on doing something about these injustices so, in large part due to limited resources, they resort to despicable terrorist methods. Israel should have every right to defend itself, but it is debatable as to whether or not they should even be there in the first place.

As a response to this situation, the rest of the world sits around and contemplates reasonable approaches to solving the problem. But, the root of the problem is that both groups of people believe that they have divine right to this chunk of land based on the will of some supernatural deity. Trying to come up with a reasonable solution is a futile approach because neither of these groups of people are interested in reason! The basic premise of the conflict is firmly rooted in non-reason, based on beliefs held in a state of ignorance! When the rest of the world acknowledges or otherwise participates in the conflict it only serves to condone and perpetuate ignorance. Worse yet, this conflict of stupidity could very possibly escalate into a world war. It’s sad that a region full of antiquated cultures fighting over something so fundamentally moronic could ultimately destroy all societies as we know them.

The best course of action that the rest of us can take is to ignore them. The indescribably sad reality is that many innocent people on both sides have, are, and will continue to suffer due to this situation. However, that does not change the reality that this conflict will not stop until one group defeats the other, or reason eventually prevails (we all know this will not occur). With this being the case, quite frankly, I am tired of hearing about it.

As always, Cherd. Clear and succinct

[Jetpilot07]

YEA!!!!! NUKE THE BASTARDS BACK INTO THE STONEAGE!!!

I mean, let's hope for the best outcome!!!!

[denzee]

Originally Posted by cherd

It’s not a matter of who is right and who is wrong, they are both wrong. The state of modern Israel was created by annexing a chunk of land that belonged to the Palestinians. The Palestinians have every right to be angry about this, among other things (crusades, etc.). Jewish Israelites do seem to try to exist as a productive, semi-harmonious society, however, this is a luxury afforded them due to support of outside interests (mainly the US). Some extremist Palestinian groups are hell-bent on doing something about these injustices so, in large part due to limited resources, they resort to despicable terrorist methods. Israel should have every right to defend itself, but it is debatable as to whether or not they should even be there in the first place.

As a response to this situation, the rest of the world sits around and contemplates reasonable approaches to solving the problem. But, the root of the problem is that both groups of people believe that they have divine right to this chunk of land based on the will of some supernatural deity. Trying to come up with a reasonable solution is a futile approach because neither of these groups of people are interested in reason! The basic premise of the conflict is firmly rooted in non-reason, based on beliefs held in a state of ignorance! When the rest of the world acknowledges or otherwise participates in the conflict it only serves to condone and perpetuate ignorance. Worse yet, this conflict of stupidity could very possibly escalate into a world war. It’s sad that a region full of antiquated cultures fighting over something so fundamentally moronic could ultimately destroy all societies as we know them.

The best course of action that the rest of us can take is to ignore them. The indescribably sad reality is that many innocent people on both sides have, are, and will continue to suffer due to this situation. However, that does not change the reality that this conflict will not stop until one group defeats the other, or reason eventually prevails (we all know this will not occur). With this being the case, quite frankly, I am tired of hearing about it.

This piece has so many inaccuracies in it that I am quite frankly tired of responding to, so all I am going to do is suggest to do some research on the history of the area as well as the current situation at this site. You may say it's bias but I think as you read it and go to other areas on the site, you'll find it is balanced and it will allow you to have a better understanding of what's going on. It'll take some time as this is a complicated political mess but in the end it should help. I linked to the Myths and Facts page to make it easy but browse around.

Myths & Facts - Index of Myths

[cherd]

Originally Posted by denzee

This piece has so many inaccuracies in it that I am quite frankly tired of responding to, so all I am going to do is suggest to do some research on the history of the area as well as the current situation at this site. You may say it's bias but I think as you read it and go to other areas on the site, you'll find it is balanced and it will allow you to have a better understanding of what's going on. It'll take some time as this is a complicated political mess but in the end it should help. I linked to the Myths and Facts page to make it easy but browse around.

So many inaccuracies? The post that you are referring too is composed almost entirely of opinion. The only things that were stated in a factual sense are:

-The state of modern Israel was created by annexing a chunk of land that belonged to the Palestinians.
-Some extremist Palestinian groups are hell-bent on doing something about these injustices.
-both groups of people believe that they have divine right to this chunk of land based on the will of some supernatural deity.

Any inaccuracies there? Not to defend one wrong side over the other wrong side, but judging by the subject content of the website that you suggested, I assume that you have a problem with the statement “it is debatable as to whether or not they (Israel) should even be there in the first place.” So, lets see what your website has to say about it:

The Jewish people base their claim to the Land of Israel on at least four premises:
1) The Jewish people settled and developed the land.
2) The territory was captured in defensive wars.
3) The international community granted political sovereignty in Palestine to the Jewish people.
4) God promised the land to the patriarch Abraham. (Are they really claiming this as a line of reasoning?!)

As for premise 1, being the first person to arrive at a patch of land does not make it forever yours. As for premise 2, nearly every parcel of land on earth that has any real value has changed hands at least once by force (and of course the inhabitants are trying to “defend” the land). If these reasons can be used to decide who can “claim” land, then I must own a nice chunk of land in Germany (unbeknownst to the Germans). And sorry denzee, but your people have no right to Ontario, your house actually belongs to a family of Chippewa Indians. And, as for premise 3, international agreement would not make you feel any better about loosing your land to the Chippewas. So that leaves us with premise 4, which is utterly ridiculous, but in reality is the actual reason that Jews feel that they have a “claim” to the land.

I'm certainly not a student of the subject, but I am fairly familiar with the history. You suggest that I do some research so that I can understand the "complicated political mess". But the point that I am trying to make is that the entire mess is rooted in ideas that are ridiculous, antiquated, and just plain wrong! (both sides)

[dicknose]

I think the "claims" to the land are irrelevent.
They are history - Israel has been granted that land and will keep it.

Taking the current issue and saying its about getting all or nothing of the land is already turning the issue into a problem without a compromise solution.

The problem is far more about the current conditions of the Palestinians.
They dont have a country of their own (its a funny condition - they are considered by some as a semi-autonomous religion within Isreal).
They are inside Israel but treated as a different class of citizen and restricted in movement. They have little in the way of infrastructure, so they rely on Israel for just about everything. Israel has built walls to keep them in, regularly closes borders and when many rely on jobs inside Israel this makes even getting to work a huge effort and at times not possible.

The history of the region is complicated. And yes some people on both sides are in a "its us or them" fight and will argue over the rights and history of the land.
But for many (and probably most) its about living at the moment. Most Palestinians have nothing like the sort of things we take for granted, freedom of movement, reliable power and water, decent hospital facilities.
They have a standard of living that is terrible compared to the rest of Israel. They also have no control over these things - most of the restrictions on what they have and can do is up to Israel.

[JEBSTER52]

And all they have to do is stop killing and mean it when they sigh it or they will be dtroyed! Rocket science huh?

[cherd]

I'm glad Jeb wasn't born Palestinian, he'd have a bomb strapped to himself quicker than you could yell "Jihad!".

[Surffrog]

Originally Posted by cherd

I'm glad Jeb wasn't born Palestinian, he'd have a bomb strapped to himself quicker than you could yell "Jihad!".

Rep awarded for that one Cherd. Well said

[Rbro]

Originally Posted by JEBSTER52

And all they have to do is stop killing and mean it when they sigh it or they will be dtroyed! Rocket science huh?

Arabs have a hard time adapting. Too rigid and think that
politics doesn't apply to them. Can't differentiate between
intent and method. I think all this related to how they treat
their women. Nothing to do with their religion.

Maybe they need to accept Israel has won. Move on.