MotoGP Displacement Limits?

Baketech · 07-28-2003, 3:38 PM

Any one have a good link or article concerning the options being considered for the future MotoGP rulebook? I read that FIM & Dorna are considering a 750cc displacement limit for 4 strokes.....

ccwilli3 · 07-28-2003, 3:48 PM

it'll be 990 for a very long time. Everyone (the manufacturers) has huge investments in R&D for engine development around this size...

GPs would surprise me if they change from 990 anytime soon.

coderedcbr · 07-28-2003, 3:51 PM

Quote:

ccwilli3 : it'll be 990 for a very long time. *Everyone (the manufacturers) has huge investments in R&D for engine development around this size... *

GPs would surprise me if they change from 990 anytime soon.

Very true

Baketech · 07-28-2003, 4:11 PM

From the blurb I read, it stated understanding of the R&D situation, but that the option was being explored due to the Katoh accident. They are faced with removing Suzuka (and maybe others) from the roster or limiting the bikes somewhat.....

ccwilli3 · 07-28-2003, 4:31 PM

Quote:

Baketech : From the blurb I read, it stated understanding of the R&D situation, but that the option was being explored due to the Katoh accident. They are faced with removing Suzuka (and maybe others) from the roster or limiting the bikes somewhat.....

that was a knee jerk reaction to the incident...

With MotoGP posting the big top speed digits they have this year and impressing even F1 regulars with the speed, etc; you won't see them do anything to change that. That was getting too much press and notariety for them to change anything about it...

tigerblade · 07-29-2003, 9:16 AM

I've got an idea: create runoff. *Concrete walls=bad. It doesn't matter a whole lot if you hit a wall at 190 mph as opposed to 204 mph.

I haven't seen anything on displacement limits. I agree with Charlie; the R&D cost would have the manufacturers fighting it.

Chain · 07-29-2003, 9:33 AM

Quote:

Baketech : From the blurb I read, it stated understanding of the R&D situation, but that the option was being explored due to the Katoh accident. They are faced with removing Suzuka (and maybe others) from the roster or limiting the bikes somewhat.....

I bet they alter venues before slowing down the bikes.

Remember all the crashes at Indy, oh, eight or ten years ago? The deaths in practice and in time trials? I seem to recall that there was a movement to slow the cars down.

All that happened last year was a rookie driver turned the fastest lap at the Speedway since 1996.

So the point is, I think these calls to slow the bikes is nothing more than knee jerk reactionaries venting a little bit.

ccwilli3 · 07-29-2003, 10:45 AM

Quote:

tigerblade : I haven't seen anything on displacement limits. *I agree with Charlie; the R&D cost would have the manufacturers fighting it.

Reference the uproar in WSBK about them changing things too frequently if you need more backup. MotoGP has the manufacturers hooked, they don't like what WSBK is doing and they love the freedom of the big 4 strokes.

And be it prototype or not, 4 stroke GPs will sell streetbikes.

luvtolean · 07-29-2003, 5:17 PM

Quote:

Chain : I bet they alter venues before slowing down the bikes.

I'll take that bet. So what are we bettin'?

ccwilli3 · 07-29-2003, 5:32 PM

Quote:

luvtolean : Quote (Chain @ July 29 2003, 9:33am)I bet they alter venues before slowing down the bikes.

I'll take that bet. So what are we bettin'?
amasuperbike said just today that suzuka was out for next year...

luvtolean · 07-29-2003, 5:34 PM

Fine. I'll still take the bet. Suzuka may be out, but the bikes are going to get limited before they start redoing tracks.

Just like F1...

929flyer · 07-29-2003, 5:49 PM

luvtolean has a point fellas. Run off room equates to moving fans back from the action. Fans, including me and you, love to be as close to the action as possible. Hence, the NASCAR oval where everyone is around the loop. They made walls (in part) to keep the racers out of the fans. Better design will lead to better tracks, but a GP event of 100,000+ people they can't all line up a thousand deep along the one straight wall.

Compromise, compromise, compromise. Fast bikes, close to the action, level of danger, where do you limit what?

jetbdude · 07-29-2003, 5:53 PM

Quote:

tigerblade : Concrete walls=bad. *It doesn't matter a whole lot if you hit a wall at 190 mph as opposed to 204 mph.

luvtolean · 07-29-2003, 5:55 PM

Quote:

jetbdude : Quote (tigerblade @ July 29 2003, 9:16am)Concrete walls=bad. *It doesn't matter a whole lot if you hit a wall at 190 mph as opposed to 204 mph.

But unfortunately, if they don't do anything it will make them look bad.

Baketech · 07-29-2003, 6:01 PM

I have a hunch that cc limits aren't as far off as you might think. From what I have read, Dorna is pressing the issue more than FIM.....even though riders are in favor of fixing or building tracks.

Edit:
Has anyone discussed the new cc regs for AMA in 2004?
Particularly Formula Extreme?

Crash · 07-29-2003, 10:43 PM

Quote:

Baketech : Edit:
Has anyone discussed the new cc regs for AMA in 2004?
Particularly Formula Extreme?

No, but all I've been hearing is that FX will be open to more bikes, there are plans to run 650cc FX bikes. Possible displacement increase to 1100 or 1200cc but the busa's running in the series have been horrible....

ccwilli3 · 07-29-2003, 10:50 PM

Quote:

Baketech : Has anyone discussed the new cc regs for AMA in 2004?
Particularly Formula Extreme?

Yeah,

You are gonna see the most tricked out 600s EVER when this starts, 600RR with Ohlins R/T forks, trick linkages for the suspension, I CAN'T WAIT!

The biggest I saw was 600cc and 350gp bikes can run there (though, that concept in and of itself is stupid, bumping 250 displacement to that will make it not handle like a 250 anymore).

This requirement wasn't because the bikes were too fast however, they were still slower than the superbikes, despite pretty much unlimited engine displacements... The chasis development just isn't there. They made this change because they were competing too much with superbike with FX in its present state...

Expect too that you see mladin and yates not being able to run FX practice when they have no intentions of running the race... There is supposed to be a meeting before VIR and I bet they do something about that.

Baketech · 07-29-2003, 10:52 PM

Superbikes will be 1000cc for all configs

Superstock will allow 1000's

250's.....gone

The above changes mean that FX will be a weird one next year....totally redone.
600cc Superbike fours
750cc Twins
250-330cc Two Strokes

ccwilli3 · 07-29-2003, 10:52 PM

And I still say you won't see a displacement change anytime soon. MAYBE a tire change like F1 (the grooved tires) or something similar to 'control' speed but you won't see them limit much tech or HP anytime soon.

Thats just my opinion and I surely hope they do not start limiting GP power, that would just kill it as we know it presently...

Baketech · 07-29-2003, 11:01 PM

Not to disagree, but it hasn't killed F1...I think it will progress in a similar way.....just my 2 cents

As far as AMA....how would you like to be one of the poor bastids that has a ton of bucks wrapped up in 250 smoker stuf.....aaaarghhhhh

ccwilli3 · 07-29-2003, 11:36 PM

Quote:

Baketech : As far as AMA....how would you like to be one of the poor bastids that has a ton of bucks wrapped up in 250 smoker stuf.....aaaarghhhhh

For sure man... It really sucks, I like watching the 250s and their racing line, its all about the corner speed!

bring on the tricked out 600s though!

luvtolean · 07-30-2003, 11:24 AM

Maybe you guys missed it, the 250's will be legal in FX. Although it's certainly not FX anymore, title notwithstanding...

Baketech · 07-30-2003, 1:22 PM

Quote:

luvtolean : Maybe you guys missed it, the 250's will be legal in FX. *Although it's certainly not FX anymore, title notwithstanding...

Its in my post above....plus the displacement can go up to 330.....

I agree that there is nothing 'extreme' about FX next