[pre5ton]

I got hit a few weeks ago by a beer truck pulling a u-turn in the middle of the road who didn't see me. I was in the lane closest to the median traveling between 35-45 mph and he was on the shoulder of the road when he decided to pull a U-turn clear in front of me. His insurance company is now fighting with me and saying that it is partially my fault since I should have been able to stop. He was cited with an unsafe left turn and I was not cited. The police report says that I was going approx. 36 mph and my bike left 54 feet worth of skid marks and then slid another 44 feet into his truck (after I locked my brakes and laid it down).

I need some sort of statistics or a clear website or article that describes the reduced stopping ability after a motorcycle's brakes lock and the loss of stability and control after a front brake is locked up. The insurance lady that is handling my claim admits that she knows nothing about motorcycles and is just googling information (she picked numbers from a vfr with ABS and CBS and said if that bike can stop, I can stop.) Any help would be appreciated. They are trying to cut my money in half.

[slickwill]

The VFR with ABS would be a completely different story. You for sure need to insist that she uses numbers from a bike that doesn't have ABS.


However (not trying to bust your chops here), 54 feet of skid marks and then 44 more seem like a REALLY long way for only 36mph. I know my bike will stop from 36mph in less than 54 feet. I have a big empty place and a 100ft tape so I'll measure today using only front brake, only rear brake, locked up rear brake, and both brakes.

[lanbrown]

Try a different route. The driver worked for a company and thus they are responsible. Try bypassing the insurance company and talk directly to beer company and say you wan tto resolve this, but if the insurance company continues to shift fault you will hire an attorney. if you stillw ant to dela with the insurance comapny, just ask them, do you think a judge will allow the information that she googled? A judge will want an expert in person; probably with a phd. The insurance rep may have a phd in Google, but it won't hold water. You could also state, what road conditions is that based on and were they exactly the same as this one? Next, ask what tires were used; different tires provide more or less traction than others. Lastly, was that an expert rider in that test? Not everyone is an expert, if that were the case, then you wouldn't have professional drivers as everyone could go and set the same lap time.

[FB1000inPA]

What Ian said. Go get an attorney. Do not say anything, don't sign anything, keep your mouth shut. Get copies of the police report and let the attorney do the job.

[pre5ton]

Originally Posted by FB1000inPA

What Ian said. Go get an attorney. Do not say anything, don't sign anything, keep your mouth shut. Get copies of the police report and let the attorney do the job.

The problem with hiring an attorney is that I gain only a small amount more than if I fought with them myself and it would take a lot longer. I didn't have any serious injuries, didn't even go to the hospital. I was wearing all of my gear and was cleared by the EMTs on the scene. I know now that I should have went to the hospital and it would make my case much easier, but its too late now. The insurance company and I estimated the same amount of damages = $8,300 for my bike, aftermarket parts, gear, and missed work. They offered my $4,500 a few days ago saying it was partly my fault and I told them no way that I will hire a lawyer if they want to play games.

If a laywer takes 35% of $8,300 that only leaves me $5,395 and at least six months wasted riding time.

[lanbrown]

It won't take longer, they will want to settle. Not having an attorney takes longer as they have no incentive. Your attorney can also go after his fees from them as well. He would also put in that they will be responsible for any injuries from the accident for a time period like a year or two.

[pre5ton]

I called the Law Tigers - "The Lawyers who Ride" - which is a firm thats headquarters is here in Phoenix and he suggested that I try my best to settle with the insurance company, but if i'm not satisfied to take them to small claims court. He said I will be in and out within 45 days and the judge should rule in my favor. Suggested it wouldn't be worth it to pay for an attorney when I have no bodily injury claims and its all just property damage.

[lanbrown]

Use the police report and say the police found their customer is at fault and that a judge almost always believes the police unless the insurance company can get a forensic scientist to state a different story. Ask to speak to their supervisor; as the claims people can get fired if they do too much for the other party too often. Ask for a mediator might work.

[Ol' Gravy Leg]

filing a complaint in small claims will grease the wheels of justice for you.

go ligers!

[lanbrown]

Why not cause a stir for the beer company? If there is a bus bench near them, see if you can place an ad for a month.

[Ol' Gravy Leg]

because, he's not even on the beer company's radar, and the beer company didn't do anything wrong. i'm sure they feel that this is what insurance is for.

it's the insurance company trying to relinquish responsibility. that's how they make their money--usually by screwing the little guy.

[lanbrown]

But they did. If he got an attorney involved, the lawsuit would have the name of the beer company on it. From there they can turn it over to the insurance or pay it themselves. The insurance company would then handle it if it was turned over to them.

The driver was an employee of the beer company, on company time driving a company truck. They are liable.

[jkobflys]

Originally Posted by lanbrown

But they did. If he got an attorney involved, the lawsuit would have the name of the beer company on it. From there they can turn it over to the insurance or pay it themselves. The insurance company would then handle it if it was turned over to them.

The driver was an employee of the beer company, on company time driving a company truck. They are liable.

thats right, i drive a company car and the insurance policy is way above the average coverage, just for this type of situations specially in a comercial vehicle, whatever you do dont admit any of the blame not even half...

[Ol' Gravy Leg]

Originally Posted by lanbrown

But they did. If he got an attorney involved, the lawsuit would have the name of the beer company on it. From there they can turn it over to the insurance or pay it themselves. The insurance company would then handle it if it was turned over to them.

The driver was an employee of the beer company, on company time driving a company truck. They are liable.

when i was in an accident, i sued the driver of the vehicle. the entire claim and lawsuit was handled by the insurance company. i never heard or saw the driver again, not even in court when the case was litigated.

i just don't see what contacting the beer company will do. one of their drivers was involved in an accident. happens all the time. there was no malice or extenuating circumstances (e.g, under the influence, etc.) to capitalize on in order to make the company look bad.

if the OP wants the full amount, then he'll have to provide evidence showing that he wasn't speeding and convince the adjuster. or, take them to court.

[Ol' Gravy Leg]

the OP could argue that only the rear brake was locked, which would offer a reduced braking efficacy and stability.

because come on, at almost 100 ft of skidding/sliding, you could have been on ice and stopped in time at 35 mph. so, how fast were you really going?

[lanbrown]

exactly, you sued the driver of the vehicle. Since a company is involved, you sue the company. If the driver killed someone, the family would seek far beyond what the policy covers; the insurance company would pay the maximum the policy allows and then the family would get the rest of the money from the company. When you sued, if the policy didn't cover the amount awarded, you could go after the driver but the insurance company would have paid up to the maximum the policy allowed.

The police report is all he needs, he may need to go to court if the driver tries to get the ticket dismissed though. The ticket shows the fault.

You can make the company look bad as it is bad publicity.

To the OP, what beer company?

[Ol' Gravy Leg]

which beer company can be important. it could be a company whose slogan is, "if you want a beer really bad, then we have a really bad beer!"

in which case, they wouldn't really care about bad publicity.

[lanbrown]

He could put the ad out there that says:
"If you think their customers drive bad when they're drunk, you should see their employees drive sober."

[slickwill]

Originally Posted by lanbrown

He could put the ad out there that says:
"If you think their customers drive bad when they're drunk, you should see their employees drive sober."

That one made me laugh.

[lanbrown]

How long do you think it would take before a call was made about it? How long do you think it would take them to make a fair offer which would cover the bike?

[jkobflys]

Originally Posted by slickwill

That one made me laugh.

[pre5ton]

The beer company is Crescent Crown Distribution. Its a beer distribution company here in Phoenix. They deliver Miller and Coors that I know of. The truck that hit me had the miller logo and slogans all over it.

I was probably going 45. I had just shifted into second gear and was just cruising. I skidded a good long way because I think I locked up the rear brake almost immediately and slowly grabbed the front brake. When I realized I wasn't going to be able to stop, I think I pulled on the front brake a bit too quick and thats when I high sided.

I called the Safety and Training Manager of Crescent Crown earlier today and left him a voicemail asking if he would like to settle outside of court before I hired a lawyer - he never returned my call. I talked to the insurance agent again today and she said that she was going to do some more researching on stopping distance, etc. and give me a call on monday or tuesday. I'm looking to get at least $6,500.

Ian - I don't know how long it will take for them to make a fair offer. I don't think they are going to go much further after this next offer with investigating. There is not a lot of available research or a way to determine how long it would take to stop. If there was a study on how far a motorcycle would take to stop using only the rear brake going 35-40 mph, that would definitely help my case.

Open to any ideas or suggestions guys. Thanks for all the replies.

[lanbrown]

want a suggestion, keep your mouth shut. You want to present the fact that you only used the rear and then used not enough front to too much. You are at fault.

[bettingpython]

This is going nowhere