ARGH!#@#! Fuel Pump Issue - Honda Motorcycles - FireBlades.org
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post #1 of 16 Old 09-07-2004, 3:53 AM Thread Starter
 
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ARGH!#@#! Fuel Pump Issue

So, I fixed my overheating issue. Now this:

Everytime I turn the key on, I get power. - Good

I flip the ignition switch to on and the fuel pump doesnt come on. - Not Good
Neither does the damn headlight. - Not Good

What's goin on here? I tinkered a little with the gas tank and it seems that once the gas tank touches metal, the headlight and fuel pump come on if the switch is to the ON position.

It seems to me like it's a grounding issue, but where? Anyone have some thoughts or input?
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post #2 of 16 Old 09-07-2004, 11:18 AM
 
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Re: ARGH!#@#! Fuel Pump Issue

It sounds to me like you have a pinched harness somewhere.
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post #3 of 16 Old 09-10-2004, 1:50 AM Thread Starter
 
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Re: ARGH!#@#! Fuel Pump Issue

Well, still nothing can be found. I've come to the conclusion at least I know it's a grounding issue.

Now to find the damn ground. It's a PITA. I will say this tho. It more or less happened after I participated in some activities that the majority of you frown on. Wheelies.

On an old airport road, me and a few buddies were just messing around and I came down hard once after coming up a little too high. Tapped the rear brake and the front end came down fast. Fork seals were ok though.

Maybe something could've jarred loose?
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post #4 of 16 Old 09-10-2004, 2:32 AM
 
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Re: ARGH!#@#! Fuel Pump Issue

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Originally Posted by victoRR
Well, still nothing can be found. I've come to the conclusion at least I know it's a grounding issue.

Now to find the damn ground. It's a PITA. I will say this tho. It more or less happened after I participated in some activities that the majority of you frown on. Wheelies.

On an old airport road, me and a few buddies were just messing around and I came down hard once after coming up a little too high. Tapped the rear brake and the front end came down fast. Fork seals were ok though.

Maybe something could've jarred loose?
Ya think Start looking for pinched wires or abrasions where the loom touches the frame, bends around corners, etc.
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post #5 of 16 Old 09-10-2004, 10:24 AM
 
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Re: ARGH!#@#! Fuel Pump Issue

It's easy to pinch the wires under the tank if your taking it on & off. I assume you check the obvious...fuses? Find a voltmeter and a shop manual. good luck.

Last edited by 02FBlade; 09-10-2004 at 10:24 AM.
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post #6 of 16 Old 09-10-2004, 12:18 PM
 
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Re: ARGH!#@#! Fuel Pump Issue

For a quick fix, simply install another grounding wire from the fuel pump to the grounding point on the frame.

Then troubleshoot the wire harness at your leisure while still being able to ride.

Have to admit, I never got around to troubleshoot my wire harness... and the quick fix is still trouble free after 1.5 years.
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post #7 of 16 Old 09-10-2004, 1:06 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: ARGH!#@#! Fuel Pump Issue

I am already thinking of creating a new ground from the fuel pump wires but the problem goes beyond that. I guess I truly haddn't payed attention but the headlight is out as well.

Once grounded, the headlight and fuel pump come on. I would make a new ground hence a "quick fix" but knowing the problem is somewhere in that damn harness, would tick me off till I found it.

The gas tank is off, yes. Airbox as well to get a good view of things. Only other thing I can do is look around/on top of the head. Or just shake things around.
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post #8 of 16 Old 09-10-2004, 2:04 PM
 
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Re: ARGH!#@#! Fuel Pump Issue

I had the exact same symptoms. Headlight and fuel pump didn't work till I installed the alternative ground wire.

Check for shorted out connectors, exposed wiring, or loose connections. If nothing seems to be shorted out or burnt, I would just proceed to install the new wire and not worry about it too much. Ultimately the new wire just provides another path to ground and works just as well as repairing the wire harness.

good luck.
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post #9 of 16 Old 09-11-2004, 11:37 AM
 
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Re: ARGH!#@#! Fuel Pump Issue

VictoRR,
Give me a call 310-2732 tomorrow (Sunday the 12th) and I will get you my manual or if you live close to 3406/Sun Rise, you might be able to catch me today between 3pm and 4pm. I am on a tight schedule today but tomorrow should be fairly open. You might call my cell phone today and I will get back to you. Heck...here are all the ways you can contact me. Pick one and we can work it out from there since I am at work today the pager is the best bet since it works in the fab.

Good Luck,
The other Victor

Pager 208-8879
Cell 921-8069
Home 310-2732

Can you say 6 in a ROW!!!!
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post #10 of 16 Old 09-11-2004, 12:38 PM
 
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Re: ARGH!#@#! Fuel Pump Issue

If I'm not mistaken, the ground for the fuel pump is inside the tank and runs from the fuel pump connector to the fuel pump mounting plate. I would take out the fuel pump and check this first, then check to see if you get continuity between the tank and the frame with the tank mounted.
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post #11 of 16 Old 09-11-2004, 4:41 PM
 
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Re: ARGH!#@#! Fuel Pump Issue

I am home now so you can try my cell to arrange for the manual pickup or I am willing to assist if you want some help also have a couple of spare meters if you need one. I was looking at the schematics and there are a lot of share grounds for the headlight relay and there is also a large connector which is unlabled on the schematics. Test to see if your horn works. If it does, there may just be an open ground somewhere. If not, you lost a ground for a lot of things other than just the headlight and fuel pump.

Can you say 6 in a ROW!!!!
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post #12 of 16 Old 09-11-2004, 7:49 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: ARGH!#@#! Fuel Pump Issue

Welp, I'll be at my parents house workin on the thing.

I am currently draining my fuel tank so I can take out the pump and check the wiring. Hopefully it can tell me something about the problem I am having. I am going to be here the rest of the night, with trips indoors to watch the UT/Arkansas game.

I'll also be checking the rest of the harness for loose wires/grounds. I HAVE to find the culprit. Feel free to give me a hollar. I won't be leaving anytime soon. 512-736-6208.

-#2



EDIT: Ok, so I removed the fuel pump and that's not the culprit. I checked all the wiring and hoses and all seemed to be in tact.

Last edited by victoRR; 09-11-2004 at 7:58 PM.
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post #13 of 16 Old 09-12-2004, 9:17 PM
 
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Re: ARGH!#@#! Fuel Pump Issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by victoRR
EDIT: Ok, so I removed the fuel pump and that's not the culprit. I checked all the wiring and hoses and all seemed to be in tact.
Do you have any aftermarket stuff wired into the bike? Garage door openers, GPS, Radar Detector?

While wiring a radar detector into an ignition controlled power source I located a few wires in the large grey connector under the right side intake cover. There were 3 or 4 wires that would prevent the fuel pump from running if they were used to power the radar detector.

Maybe one of those wires has a short in it? Do you have a volt meter? You should have 12v to the fuel pump. That would tell you if it was a ground problem or something preventing power to get the pump.

What about the bank angle sensor? If that is stuck it would keep the fuel pump from running also.
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post #14 of 16 Old 09-12-2004, 9:47 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: ARGH!#@#! Fuel Pump Issue

The fuel pump issue has turned out to be an electrical nightmare. I'm almost positive not even an experienced electrician can find out what's wrong.

I borrowed (Mavic's) manual for the time being to take a look at the schematics.

I had no idea on how to do a self diagnostic check on the bike. When I did it, I came up with the following blinking MIL's:
8, 11, 12, 13, 14, 18 and 19. I cleared the codes, rode around a little bit (with an alternate ground) then checked for any new codes. Nothing.

As I trace the ground from the fuel pump to other places on the bike (a crapload) I don't find anything out of the ordinary. I did however find my radiator (right side mount) had come off the peg a little. I quickly slipped it back on. I shook some wires, checked any loose connections. Nothing.

I proceeded to put everything back to normal. No alternate grounds...nothing. Turn the Key On. Ignition On. WTF, the headlight is on, fuel pump comes on.
Ok....so this has me stumped. I checked the radiator since it was the only thing I had moved or adjusted last. That's the culprit. Seems as if the bracket on the top right side of the radiator is touching the frame.

Same thing all over again. Since the radiator is touching the frame, the ground that I can't seem to find is now grounded.

If this confuses you, trust me...it does with me as well.

Since I put the rubber isolator back on the bottom tank bolt and collar, the tank wasn't grounded. Bike wouldn't run. I messed with the radiator a little bit since it wasn't on perfect (don't ask how or why) that became the ground.

I checked everything. (not really....I don't have a voltmeter). In the schematic for the wiring harness in the back of the Svc. Manual, I tried tracing what I could at best with nothing found (out of the ordinary without a voltmeter).

Someone, help out.
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post #15 of 16 Old 09-12-2004, 9:49 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: ARGH!#@#! Fuel Pump Issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by EatnAsphalt
Do you have any aftermarket stuff wired into the bike? Garage door openers, GPS, Radar Detector?

While wiring a radar detector into an ignition controlled power source I located a few wires in the large grey connector under the right side intake cover. There were 3 or 4 wires that would prevent the fuel pump from running if they were used to power the radar detector.

Maybe one of those wires has a short in it? Do you have a volt meter? You should have 12v to the fuel pump. That would tell you if it was a ground problem or something preventing power to get the pump.

What about the bank angle sensor? If that is stuck it would keep the fuel pump from running also.

Sorry, the pump gets power. Only if there is a good alternative ground.

No, I don't have anything aftermarket on the bike except for the front signals.

Bank angle sensor is workin fine. I removed, and tilted it while the bike was running, off then trying to start it...and it's fine. Fuel relay works, headlight relay and signal light relay work. Map sensor is ok, IAT is ok.
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