Tyres - or is that Tires ? - Honda Motorcycles - FireBlades.org
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post #1 of 19 Old 10-18-2004, 5:38 PM Thread Starter
 
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Tyres - or is that Tires ?

OK, in this Org I've read of tyre/tire pressures ranging from 30psi front and rear, right through to the owner's manual recommendation of 36Fr/42Rr covering everything from track days to bumpy back country roads.

What does everyone run...?

It'd be interesting if you posted your tyre sizes \ brand \ and the pressures you're running.

I'm currently running :

120/190 Sportec M1s @ 34Fr/38Rr

Cheers, Spanky.
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post #2 of 19 Old 10-18-2004, 6:43 PM
 
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Re: Tyres - or is that Tires ?

Pilot Sports = 32/32 (sometimes up to 34 on a hot day)
Diablo = x/32 - still have pilot front
BT010 = 34/36 .... I hated those tires

---

-Rob.
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post #3 of 19 Old 10-18-2004, 7:23 PM
 
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Re: Tyres - or is that Tires ?

By the book Diablo Corsa front, Diablo rear (will go back to Corsa for rear depending on wear)

Must obey the sheep dog
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post #4 of 19 Old 10-18-2004, 7:27 PM
 
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Re: Tyres - or is that Tires ?

You should always go by what it says for the manufacturer. I believe the 36/42 combo was for the stock pilot and battlax tyres.

Just look it up on the manufacturer's website for road pressures, since they vary from different brands
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post #5 of 19 Old 10-18-2004, 7:29 PM
 
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Re: Tyres - or is that Tires ?

Stock Dunlop 207's 120fr/190rear 32/36
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post #6 of 19 Old 10-18-2004, 7:38 PM
 
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Re: Tyres - or is that Tires ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SouLJahz
You should always go by what it says for the manufacturer. I believe the 36/42 combo was for the stock pilot and battlax tyres.

Just look it up on the manufacturer's website for road pressures, since they vary from different brands
I truelly disagree with that -- those are always way too hard unless all you do is tour on your bike. "Generally" the harder your tire is the longer it takes to warm up and the longer it lasts cause it does not heat cycle as much.

I will never run a tire harder than 32PSI for the track. For the road 38 is really high and I would only run that on a very hot day. 42 PSI is just crazy, that gives you pretty much truck tires compared to what they are capable of in terms of traction.

-Shane
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post #7 of 19 Old 10-18-2004, 8:11 PM
 
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Re: Tyres - or is that Tires ?

I forgot to add that the manufacturer settings are for road riding, since alot of the time you will spend on your bike upright and if pressures are too low then it will square off and affect the bikes handling. Having higher pressures allows the tyre to not wear as much down the centre.

Sure having a lower pressure will have its advantages in the short run. But it really comes down to what the rider wants from the tyre. I use my bike for commuting every day and run 36/42 on the stock BT012's.

If you can keep the tyre in the shape it is meant to be in, then it will give you grip, handling and life.


Obviously this does not apply to the track.

Last edited by SouLJahz; 10-18-2004 at 8:13 PM.
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post #8 of 19 Old 10-18-2004, 8:11 PM
 
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Re: Tyres - or is that Tires ?

I'm currently running 33/33 psi in my Avon 45/46 combo (street use, never done a track day). I'm may try 32/32 psi soon. BTW, I weigh 135-140 lbs., depending on how much pizza I'm doing at any given time.
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post #9 of 19 Old 10-18-2004, 9:05 PM
 
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Re: Tyres - or is that Tires ?

This is gonna get good.

Well I am currently on Bridgestone BT014 F&R, prior I ran Bridgestone BT012 OEM not SS. I have ran the factory pressures in the past, but after trying some different suspension settings and pressures decided to stick with running 34 front and 39 rear. If I ride two up, then I'll go to the factory 36 front and 42 rear settings. I am 230+ pounds and I can't see running tire pressure too much lower. I think this is a great topic, yet it seems to come down to personal pref. everytime.

I am signed up to do a Big Willow track day on 10/26, and will be running BT012SS. I plan on running the same pressures that I do on the street or more, unless someone can justify why I shouldn't. I just can't see running anything less than 3 pounds under recommended in the front and 4 pounds under in the rear, equal pressure front and rear, not me. I found a good, but tire pressure inconclusive read here.

After reading that, I can't see running i.e. 32F 32R.

BTW, this site has some additional info on each Bridgestone tire.


Last edited by Gblade; 10-18-2004 at 9:11 PM.
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post #10 of 19 Old 10-18-2004, 9:44 PM
 
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Re: Tyres - or is that Tires ?

Heres some info regarding tyre pressures from sv650.org which should apply to most road based tyres. NOT race compound tyres. Hope it changes some of your views on correct street pressures.

> 24/09/02 Some truths about tyres and pressures. Thanks to Gareth Forge for
> this
> John. Please find attached a email I received from a work colleague
> regarding tyre pressure. I find what they say interesting to say the least.
> It may also answer some questions that keep cropping up in the forum.
>
> TYRE pressures are a crucial factor in determining how your bike handles
> and how quickly you wear your (not exactly cheap) tyres. There are lots of
> myths and misconceptions about what pressures you should run in the wet, on
> track days or when you're loaded with luggage. Usually you'll find someone
> propping up the bar who knows better than the manufacturers'
> recommendations.
> To find out how close they are to being right we talked to a genuine expert
> - a man who should know tyres if anyone does. Leo Smith spent years as
> chief development tester at Avon tyres. He is now motorcycle product
> manager. He said: " We probably get asked more about tyre pressures than
> about any other aspect of a tyre. " There's so much bad information kicking
> about that people can't separate the truth from fiction. " Smith says that
> is largely the fault of tyre companies themselves. Several years ago,
> different tyre companies recommended different pressures for different
> tyres and different bikes. But around 10 years ago, a decision was reached
> between the companies to standardise pressures so that most bikes can run
> on the same no matter what tyres they're on. That standard is 36psi at the
> front and 42psi at the rear. There are some exceptions, like 400cc grey
> imports which run 29psi at the front and 36psi at the rear. Another notable
> exception is the KawasakiZX-12R - which is meant to run 42 front and rear.
> But if you've got a modern mainstream bike, chances are you should be
> running the 36/42 standard.
> That 42 figure in particular will have a lot of the gentlemen at the bar
> shaking their heads. But it is not a figure chosen at random Pressures
> determine how your tyres deflect. The lower the pressure, the more the tyre
> will flex. That may make for a comfortable ride when you're cruising in a
> straight line, but the tyre will flex too fast at speed and make your bike
> unstable. The bike will feel vague going into turns and feel like it's
> going to tip into the corner suddenly. This is because the tyre isn't "
> strong " enough and it's literally buckling under you. The bike will also
> feel wallowy through turns and it'll weave under acceleration. Conversely,
> if you over-inflate a tyre, the flex will be slower but that will make your
> bike more stable at high speeds. The ride comfort and the tyre's ability to
> absorb shocks will be lost and your wrists and backside will take the brunt
> of it. The bike will feel so harsh that many people will think they have a
> suspension problem. Cornering won't feel as bad as when pressure is too
> low, but you will again lose feel and feedback from the tyres. For example,
> if you ride over a stone, an over-inflated tyre cannot absorb it and the
> tyre breaks contact with the road. Smith says the classic myth about tyre
> pressures is that you deflate them for wet-weather riding. He says most
> grip comes from the tyre's compound and the contact patch - and the shape
> of the tyre where it contacts the road is everything. Tread patterns stop
> water from building up under the tyres - which could caused a bike to
> aquaplane. Smith says: " A good front chucks enough water out of the way to
> enable the rear to get the power down. If you reduce the tyre pressure, the
> tread becomes compressed so it can't clear as much water. " If anything,
> Smith recommends you increase the rear tyre by 2-3psi in the wet but leave
> the front as it is.
> Another widely held misconception is that the psi recommendations are the
> maximum the tyre can take. They're not. The figure only tells at what
> pressures the tyres were tested at for all-round use. You could actually
> safely inflate a tyre up to around 50psi if you really wanted to, although
> it wouldn't do you much good. But the biggest area for debate has to be
> track days. If you've ever been to one it's almost certain someone has told
> you you'll be best off reducing your tyre pressures. You get more grip that
> way, they tell you. Smith has radically different advice. You should leave
> them alone, he says. Racing tyres are of a totally different construction
> and stiffness to road tyres so they need less pressure to maintain the
> carcass shape. That's where the rumours and bad advice comes from. If you
> drop the psi in road tyres you will get more movement in the tread pattern.
> They will heat up too much and that will eat into tyre wear. You'll almost
> certainly ruin a set in a day without gaining any advantage in grip. "
> Smith says he's known people to drop their rear tyre to just 22psi when
> heading for the track. His advice is to leave your tyres alone, saying a
> good tyre at standard pressures will give more grip than you need on a
> track day because you almost certainly won't be going as fast or for as
> long as racers. Track surfaces offer much better grip than the road, too -
> another reason for leaving your tyre pressures the same for the ride to the
> track as for the ride around it.
> Many people also ask the experts at Avon if they should increase psi to
> take pillion passengers. Again there's no need. The manufacturers' agreed
> pressures of 36/42 were arrived at after testing with pillions, luggage,
> cold tyres and every other combination you could think of. One of the few
> cases when Smith does recommend you change your pressures is when your
> tyres wear. A worn tyre has lost a lot of its strength as the shape and
> flexibility levels have changed. That means it will handle differently to a
> new tyre. Try increasing the tyres by 2psi when you're down to around 40
> per cent tread depth. It will only make a marginal difference, but it
> should improve your bike's handling a bit. You may not have to keep
> changing your tyre pressures, but you do have to maintain them. Smith
> recommends that you check them once a week as an absolute minimum but to be
> extra safe, you should really check them every day because a tyre can
> change by as much as 3psi on its own just because of changes in the
> weather. You should always measure your tyre pressures when they are cold.
> A few bikes are now coming with tyre pressure gauges in their under-saddle
> tool kits. If you haven't got one it's worth buying one. They only cost a
> few quid and take up about as much room as a pen. Forecourt gauges are
> notoriously inaccurate.
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post #11 of 19 Old 10-18-2004, 10:21 PM
 
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Re: Tyres - or is that Tires ?

You will get better grip with a lower pressure, but more lively handling with higher pressure. A tire will wear faster with lower pressure. On the track, the highest pressure that still gives you the grip you want is best. By staying at, say, 38 for the rear, you will be giving up some of the additional grip that you'd have at 34. Running 30 pounds gives a bit more than 34, but the tires will wear faster. Most street tires do well on the track at 32 or so.
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post #12 of 19 Old 10-18-2004, 10:28 PM
 
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Re: Tyres - or is that Tires ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SouLJahz
The manufacturers' agreed
> pressures of 36/42 were arrived at after testing with pillions, luggage,
> cold tyres and every other combination you could think of.
Wet pavement and the water dispersal issue aside, I still can't believe that a "set in concrete" recommendation of 36/42 would be good for all riders. A 250-300 lb. rider might get a fairly cush ride with these settings, but what about us lightweights? And the remark about tire flex at lower psi settings, would this characteristic not be less for a light rider? I'm still not buying it - I'm stickin' to my 33/33 for awhile.
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post #13 of 19 Old 10-19-2004, 2:38 AM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Tyres - or is that Tires ?

The debate developing here is one of the reasons I wanted to start this thread - I've been amazed at the range of tyre pressures that members have been talking about, back in the 'old days' (70s and 80s) we used to run 100/120 28Fr/32Rr just about no matter what we were riding (well 110s on the back of RD400s and the like and maybe on the front of our GSX750s).

My '88 GSX600 ran 33Fr/36Rr pressures, and recently it surprised me to read in the owner's manual of my 929 the recommended 36Fr/42Rr...creeping up and up with each new generation of bikes/tyres.

I started out on the 929 with the standard 36/42 pressures, but felt the tyres weren't working as well as they might at slightly lower pressures (probably as much as anything as a result of my previous experiences on older bikes)...but on reflection I don't remember the tyres misbehaving themselves when set at the higher pressures (probably didn't push em real hard though either ).

The references in previous replies in this thread to manufacturers recommendations agrees with what we always used to do - but it was the tyre manufacturers we listened to, not the vehicle manufacturer as they always seemed to recommend something lower in the interests of a "comfortable ride"...however in this case the bike manufacturers are saying the same thing as the tyre manufacturers - so maybe the 36Fr/42Rr is the way to go unless something happens to unsettle you and dent your confidence...afterall fast riding has a lot to do with confidence in your equipment right .

How do you guys who ride with lower pressures find the handling characteristics of your bikes ?, can you relate to anything that the reply from SouLJahz contains

Cheers, Spanky
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post #14 of 19 Old 10-19-2004, 4:48 AM
 
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Re: Tyres - or is that Tires ?

Street 35F/35R (lots of canyons in my area, rarely riding straight up)
Track 32F/30R
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post #15 of 19 Old 10-19-2004, 5:33 AM
 
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Re: Tyres - or is that Tires ?

I believe the manufacturers recommendation is just that, a recommendation, which works for almost all riders, it's a bit like buying a race suit.. you could go out and get a Joe Rocket 42/52 which should fit a few diff shapes/sizes or you could spend a few extra bux and get a tailored fit... the same should apply to tyres... 36F42R would work for most, but if you want what works best for you, customize it... trial and error... it's not like adding or taking away air is a difficult task for anyone

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