Fireblade 08 - Aftermarket Exhaust - Page 40 - Honda Motorcycles - FireBlades.org
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post #586 of 598 Old 04-12-2014, 11:41 PM
 
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Re: Fireblade 08 - Aftermarket Exhaust

for what it is worth to anyone.......i ended up installing the Yoshi slip on. Here is my feedback:
- Great sound (louder and with a deeper base)
- Weight change (however small) was noticable
- little more power at the lower end to about 4000rpm.
- easy to install, except a little tinkering needed with the side cover to align it to the lower fairing.
- DB phone app measures noise levels right on legal limit and within manufacturers spec.
- no need to remap (no popping at all through out the gears and speeds)
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post #587 of 598 Old 04-13-2014, 3:21 AM
 
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Re: Fireblade 08 - Aftermarket Exhaust

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Originally Posted by bladeracer View Post
Two different bikes though, maybe the first one is a stronger engine anyway. Need to test the mufflers on the same bike to say definitively that one is makes more power than the other.
Not bhp, just hp, bhp is measured at the crankshaft.
You obviously didn't read the post properly... that's exactly what I did, see test 3.

2 identical bikes. Same new air filters, both at the same time, standard fuel..
Test 1 bike 1
Test 2 bike 2
Test 3 bike 2 with exhaust swapped from bike 1 to bike 2

Note the result to within 0.6bhp for bikes 1 & 2 with the Yoshi, a negligible difference when you compare that to the best result from the Leo Vince

Results in Bhp DIN at rear wheel
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post #588 of 598 Old 04-13-2014, 6:40 AM
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Re: Fireblade 08 - Aftermarket Exhaust

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Originally Posted by Firestarter View Post
You obviously didn't read the post properly... that's exactly what I did, see test 3.

2 identical bikes. Same new air filters, both at the same time, standard fuel..
Test 1 bike 1
Test 2 bike 2
Test 3 bike 2 with exhaust swapped from bike 1 to bike 2

Note the result to within 0.6bhp for bikes 1 & 2 with the Yoshi, a negligible difference when you compare that to the best result from the Leo Vince

Results in Bhp DIN at rear wheel

You're right, I missed that bit :-)

No, the "brake" part of Bhp means it's measured at the crankshaft. Do you mean that your figures are calculated back to Bhp from actual hp figures?

"I won't forget that ride for a while. Maybe you're right. Living fast might be worth the final crash. Maybe that's the secret you fliers know." - Flight of the Intruder
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post #589 of 598 Old 04-13-2014, 7:54 AM
 
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Re: Fireblade 08 - Aftermarket Exhaust

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Originally Posted by bladeracer View Post
You're right, I missed that bit :-)

No, the "brake" part of Bhp means it's measured at the crankshaft. Do you mean that your figures are calculated back to Bhp from actual hp figures?
The point of the post was to show a genuine significant difference between 2 exhausts. All other factors the same.

The Bhp I've quoted was rear wheel brake horse power calculated from torque on a braked dyno, whether quoting figures in bhp is scientifically correct or not is not something I'm interested in debating, its what most people recognise, there are plenty of opinions on Hp, bhp, sae, din, whp, etc etc save it for another post..
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post #590 of 598 Old 04-13-2014, 8:01 AM
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Re: Fireblade 08 - Aftermarket Exhaust

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Originally Posted by Firestarter View Post
The point of the post was to show a genuine significant difference between 2 exhausts. All other factors the same.

The Bhp I've quoted was rear wheel brake horse power calculated from torque on a braked dyno, whether quoting figures in bhp is scientifically correct or not is not something I'm interested in debating, its what most people recognise, there are plenty of opinions on Hp, bhp, sae, din, whp, etc etc save it for another post..

There is no "rear wheel brake horsepower", brake horsepower is not measured at a wheel, it is measured at the crankshaft.
The reason I mentioned this is to determine if you are merely mistaken or if you are actually quoting Bhp figures, which would obviously be very much higher than actual hp figures. There are some dyno operators that like to show highly inflated figures by trying to calculate Bhp from hp figures. It's not a question of opinions, I'm trying to clarify if your numbers are actual hp numbers measured at the wheel, or inflated "calculated" Bhp numbers at the crank.

brake horsepower - definition of brake horsepower by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.
"brake horsepowern. Abbr. bhp or b.hp. The actual or useful horsepower of an engine, usually determined from the force exerted on a friction brake or dynamometer connected to the drive shaft."

Horsepower - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
"Brake horsepower (bhp) is the measure of an engine's horsepower before the loss in power caused by the gearbox, alternator, differential, water pump, and other auxiliary components such as power steering pump, muffled exhaust system, etc."

"I won't forget that ride for a while. Maybe you're right. Living fast might be worth the final crash. Maybe that's the secret you fliers know." - Flight of the Intruder
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post #591 of 598 Old 04-13-2014, 8:17 AM
 
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Re: Fireblade 08 - Aftermarket Exhaust

I must be mistaken then I thought it referred to a calculated figure from torque, I didn't know you could measure hp. I've already said it was on a braked dyno at rear wheel so I'm not sure why you need to ask again. Obviously dynos give different results depending on various factors, the point is these 3 tests were on the same dyno the same time, or as near as possible, its irrelevant what the actual figures are, I'm sure you will agree that 2 very similar results with one make of exhaust and one significantly lower result with another shows one exhaust is better than the other. That's what the post was about...
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post #592 of 598 Old 04-13-2014, 8:21 AM
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Re: Fireblade 08 - Aftermarket Exhaust

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Originally Posted by Firestarter View Post
I must be mistaken then I thought it referred to a calculated figure from torque, I didn't know you could measure hp. I've already said it was on a braked dyno at rear wheel so I'm not sure why you need to ask again. Obviously dynos give different results depending on various factors, the point is these 3 tests were on the same dyno the same time, or as near as possible, its irrelevant what the actual figures are, I'm sure you will agree that 2 very similar results with one make of exhaust and one significantly lower result with another shows one exhaust is better than the other. That's what the post was about...

You still don't understand Bhp?
Whether it was measured at the wheel or not doesn't matter when you then quote Bhp instead of hp. As I said, some people like to inflate numbers by "calculating" actual hp back to a Bhp number. I use "calculating" in quotes as there is no accurate way to do such a "calculation".

Yes, I agree that your post was a comparison, but that shouldn't detract from having accurate information ;-)

"I won't forget that ride for a while. Maybe you're right. Living fast might be worth the final crash. Maybe that's the secret you fliers know." - Flight of the Intruder
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post #593 of 598 Old 04-13-2014, 9:23 AM
 
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Re: Fireblade 08 - Aftermarket Exhaust

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You still don't understand Bhp?
Whether it was measured at the wheel or not doesn't matter when you then quote Bhp instead of hp. As I said, some people like to inflate numbers by "calculating" actual hp back to a Bhp number. I use "calculating" in quotes as there is no accurate way to do such a "calculation".

Yes, I agree that your post was a comparison, but that shouldn't detract from having accurate information ;-)
I understand exactly what your saying.. bhp is a crank value whereas hp is a measured wheel value.. as I've said it was to din so obviously calculated to conform to that standard as opposed to sae, its not calculated back to crank values as I've said twice. You just seem to have a problem with me calling it bhp lol... Over here its perfectly normal to use bhp as a term for both, its opinion if that is right or wrong, historically all vehicles used a crank test value bhp , I still maintain the use of a braked dyno still permits the use of the term bhp (maybe there you don't) albeit at the wheel not crank. The values I've given are accurate and not inflated crank values. Does that make it more clear to you?
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post #594 of 598 Old 04-13-2014, 9:34 AM
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Re: Fireblade 08 - Aftermarket Exhaust

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Originally Posted by Firestarter View Post
I understand exactly what your saying.. bhp is a crank value whereas hp is a measured wheel value.. as I've said it was to din so obviously calculated to conform to that standard as opposed to sae, its not calculated back to crank values as I've said twice. You just seem to have a problem with me calling it bhp lol... Over here its perfectly normal to use bhp as a term for both, its opinion if that is right or wrong, historically all vehicles used a crank test value bhp , I still maintain the use of a braked dyno still permits the use of the term bhp (maybe there you don't) albeit at the wheel not crank. The values I've given are accurate and not inflated crank values. Does that make it more clear to you?

I would have the same "problem" if somebody were referring to kph as mph :-)
Yes, all manufacturers use Bhp figures because the engines are measured on engine dynos, not chassis dynos. SAE and DIN are also measured at the crank...
Bhp is a specific engineering term, using it in discussion allows everybody to be on the same page so to speak. You personally might consider it okay to use the term incorrectly, though I can't imagine why you would want to. It's your own choice whether you want to continue to use it that way, or use it correctly now that you understand what it actually means. Using it correctly though means that others that do understand won't have to ask you what you actually mean ;-)
All dynos are "braked", that does not make their results Bhp. If it weren't braked or loaded it wouldn't provide any result. The power is essentially a measurement of how much load "or brake" is required to prevent the engine accelerating the drum.

"I won't forget that ride for a while. Maybe you're right. Living fast might be worth the final crash. Maybe that's the secret you fliers know." - Flight of the Intruder
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Re: Fireblade 08 - Aftermarket Exhaust

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I would have the same "problem" if somebody were referring to kph as mph :-)
Yes, all manufacturers use Bhp figures because the engines are measured on engine dynos, not chassis dynos. SAE and DIN are also measured at the crank...
Bhp is a specific engineering term, using it in discussion allows everybody to be on the same page so to speak. You personally might consider it okay to use the term incorrectly, though I can't imagine why you would want to. It's your own choice whether you want to continue to use it that way, or use it correctly now that you understand what it actually means. Using it correctly though means that others that do understand won't have to ask you what you actually mean ;-)
All dynos are "braked", that does not make their results Bhp. If it weren't braked or loaded it wouldn't provide any result. The power is essentially a measurement of how much load "or brake" is required to prevent the engine accelerating the drum.
I really dont know why you have to keep writing condescending essays trying to correct me when we both know exactly what I'm referring to. You carry on wasting your time if you want.. SAE and DIN are different standards, irrespective of where there measured.. if you've got such little imagination as you seem to suggest the I guess you have got a problem .. rear wheel hp or rear wheel bhp hardly equates to comparing mph or kmh especially if as you say one doesn't exist..
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post #596 of 598 Old 09-29-2014, 2:25 PM
 
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Fireblade 08 - Aftermarket Exhaust

I see Akro makes a fully compatible slip on with O2 sensor mounting hole and ECV cable driven valve.
Their power/torque graph show an improvement around 4 k and a slight power gain.


Has anyone tried this one yet?


firestarter, your experiment was an interesting guideline. If you are still following this treat, bladeracer was trying to correct what looks like a common misunderstanding nothing more.


His point about the correct use of the terms is very valid. It is always acquire new knowledge
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post #597 of 598 Old 04-15-2015, 10:51 AM
 
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Re: Fireblade 08 - Aftermarket Exhaust

Hi all, hoping someone here can offer some advice.

I've got an 08 blade and want to fit my shiny new Yoshi system.

I know I can put a slip-on on without a problem, but will there be running issues with the full systems and no Power Commander? (can't afford one until next month!)

I know it would be BETTER to fit a PC5 BUT does anyone actually have any first hand experience and know where the flat spot are or what the running issues are?

I'm also running a K&N.

I currently have an Arrow slip-on and making 160 at the back wheel. So I'd be interested to hear about comparative power gains and the noise factor

Many Thanks
Saz
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post #598 of 598 Old 04-15-2015, 10:59 AM
 
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Re: Fireblade 08 - Aftermarket Exhaust

Also means the Arrow will be for sale if anyone is interested and wants to make an offer.

it has a mild scuff. pictures attached.

Thanks
S

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