954 gear problem - 4th gear worn out ?!? - Honda Motorcycles - FireBlades.org
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post #1 of 14 Old 10-06-2008, 1:24 PM Thread Starter
 
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954 gear problem - 4th gear worn out ?!?

Hello guys,
i would like to ask whether it sounds reasonable to you if only the 4 th gear on a 2002 954 gearbox might be worn out. it certainly get out of gear once you get on the gas after the shift to 4th, but at the same time it has absolutely no probs with 1,2 or 3rd gear ?!? i have been riding this bike for 15000 km for now and over an year and it started this right after a track day and 1500 km of trip to the track and back. first it began as sometimes i was "missing" the gear when i shift and it went to some kind of neutral. now it doesnt want to stay in gear - except on downshifting and engine braking.
could it be something else or is it sure that it is worn out gears.

thanks in advance to all who respond!

regards to all fellow 954 riders

one more thing i bought the bike second hand but i at least have not performed a single wheelie on it(because i cannot :-) ) but a lot of hi revs riding.
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post #2 of 14 Old 10-06-2008, 2:02 PM
 
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Re: 954 gear problem - 4th gear worn out ?!?

Could be a worn gear and/or dog-tooth. If it jumps out of gear and stays in a false "neutral", regardless of acceleration pressure, its probably the gear itself. If it slips in and out under hard acceleration, almost like you pulled in the clutch and then released it quikly, its probably the dog-teeth. Im no mechanic, so Im not sure, but this was the how the mechanic that fixed my old F4 determided the problem BEFORE he ever went into the case.

Fox
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post #3 of 14 Old 10-06-2008, 2:18 PM
 
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Re: 954 gear problem - 4th gear worn out ?!?

Yeeep. We see a lot of this happening to worn out trannies... Rip her apart and change the internals - its been covered on the site before (some have problem with second gear too)

"Second is the first of the losers..."
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post #4 of 14 Old 10-06-2008, 2:40 PM
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Re: 954 gear problem - 4th gear worn out ?!?

It's certainly possible as each gear has its own dogs that can get worn or broken.
It could possibly be a bent shift fork but I'd be betting on the gear itself being worn.

"I won't forget that ride for a while. Maybe you're right. Living fast might be worth the final crash. Maybe that's the secret you fliers know." - Flight of the Intruder
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post #5 of 14 Old 10-07-2008, 2:18 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: 954 gear problem - 4th gear worn out ?!?

thanks for the replies guys, they are much appreciated. we do not have an official stealership here or at least the guys that are doing service for the dealers are no better than my man but he tried it and the diagnosis was a strip down. so i am tearing it apart and we will see. i was and he is also surprised that it is the 4th gear which normally wouldn't happen. he bets for some bracken down or out of bed "spring washer" if this is the word so the gear is moving on the axle that could probably trash the whole engine if it blocks in place at some point. so no more riding before we get it fixed :-(.
hopefully i will get it fixed before the end of the moth for there is a free open practice weekend at the serres race track in Greece i would like to attend to.
wish me luck!
i will try to explain what the problem and the cure was after i get it fixed.
thanks again!
Dark_Ness
Dobrich
Bulgaria
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post #6 of 14 Old 10-10-2008, 2:45 PM
 
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Re: 954 gear problem - 4th gear worn out ?!?

Darkness,

I had to replace my oroginal 954 gearbox because it was jumping out of 4th & back into 3rd all the time except on full throttle. Its a flaw with the 954 that has affected many bikes now.

The problem in the angle of undercut on the gear dogs (there isnt any). The dogs & gears need to be undercut about 2 degrees to eliminate this issue. 2nd gear also give trouble as its paired with 4th.

You do have to buy a new gears to fit this. just get the dogs/receiver undercut (300 approx) in an engineering shop & its fixed forever. Fitting new parts will eventually lead to the same problem all over again.

Also check you spark plugs that they are torqued in properly - I ble no. 2 plug out of the engine & it took alll the threads with it. I had never gone near the plugs at that stage & it has happend to a few bikes now on this site.

Good luck!!
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post #7 of 14 Old 10-15-2008, 2:33 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: 954 gear problem - 4th gear worn out ?!?

thanks guys! it is the gear dogs. they look smashed and the edges are round now especially on the 4th gear. i am looking for a new gearbox assembly to put in the bike. if i do not succeed in finding a whole working set i will tear this one apart and repair the gear dogs by undercutting them as king kenny suggested. thay will become narrower but i do not think it will be a problem.
thanks again and i will keep you posted on the progress with some pics even if i get the chance to picture them.
P.S. here are some pics of the Serres Free Open Practice events that i attended this year. I hope you like them:

Click image for larger version

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Darkness' Site - Atanas' Photos

Last edited by DarkNess; 10-15-2008 at 2:50 PM.
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post #8 of 14 Old 10-15-2008, 4:13 PM
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Re: 954 gear problem - 4th gear worn out ?!?

If they're badly worn you may not have enough material to undercut them.
Undercutting them involves cutting angles back from the point of the dog which is where most of the damage occurs.
I don't know if it's possible to build them up with weld or not but it'd probably be better just to buy new ones and have those undercut.

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post #9 of 14 Old 11-03-2008, 2:25 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: 954 gear problem - 4th gear worn out ?!?

hello again guys!
so the following problems with my bike:
worn out gear dogs,
slack in the bearings of the gear wheels
slightly grind gear fork
worn out central main bearing of the crank shaft.

if some of the names are not correct, excuse me it is not my native language.
today we got the motor together again and tomorrow we will get the bike together. i hope that everything will be fine and i will have no more problems.
i am selling the bike out though, because i am leaving for the USA. i won a green card lottery visa and i am going there with my wife and my 2 year old son. i will first try my chances in Boston in MA for we have some friend there who will help us getting settled.
if some of you guys are from Boston i am pretty interested in getting a bike for track time only (salvage title, cheap) and advice on how things work there for track time and bike set up etc..

Thanks again and keep up the nice forum.
Best regards to all!

Atanas
Dobrich, Bulgaria - currently
Boston, MA - hopefully since 09.11.08
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post #10 of 14 Old 03-24-2016, 7:00 PM
 
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Re: 954 gear problem - 4th gear worn out ?!?

I'm feeling this pain of yours.

Firstly, last year 4th gone in my CBR919RR, which gearbox is now stripped down and about to be sent off to the engineers for buildup/re-grind...

And then TODAY!!! My CBR954RR does the exact same thing.. Spitting out 4th!!

Can't wait to get a newer Blade with cassette box as the dismantling etc is super painful!
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post #11 of 14 Old 03-25-2016, 12:14 PM
 
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Re: 954 gear problem - 4th gear worn out ?!?

This seems to be very common, I am having the same problem with my 929. Almost every time I use 4th is jumps back to 3rd. Plan to undercutting all the gear dogs with my own transmission if they aren't too bad and replacing the drum and forks. Thinking about putting a shift star kit from Factory Pro while I'm there. As for right now I am just skipping 4th. Really not bad actually just rev out 3rd a little higher than usual and double tap to 5th. Luckily the bike has enough torque it's not too bad. Gunna gather parts before I tear down though since I still ride everyday.
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post #12 of 14 Old 03-26-2016, 1:12 AM
 
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Re: 954 gear problem - 4th gear worn out ?!?

Not very likely that your drum will be stuffed.
On the 919 I changed the gear forks initially thinking it may solve the issue. They were worn down and some odd markings but once it was all back together again it was doing the same thing.

You'll find that it will be the actual dogs and possibly counter gear.

I'll be sending it off to get built up and re-ground. Cheaper than replacing all the stuffed gears. About AU$300 to get all gears re-ground.

As for the 954, I'll be selling it as is (no 4th) and someone else can do it.
I'll be looking at getting a brand new 1000 and be done with stuffing around with older bikes.
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post #13 of 14 Old 03-26-2016, 3:56 AM
 
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Re: 954 gear problem - 4th gear worn out ?!?

see "Re: 929 shifting issue" for a pic of worn gears and selector shaft from vfr750... Maybe useful.. Note, if the dog is worn, then the gear that it connects to is likely to be also.....

1994 CBR900RRR
1997 CBR900RRV
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post #14 of 14 Old 03-26-2016, 9:53 AM
 
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Re: 954 gear problem - 4th gear worn out ?!?

Figured out how to upload pics..
This is the 919 gears before sending them to be fixed..



[IMG][/IMG]

Last edited by Zjor; 03-26-2016 at 9:55 AM. Reason: Fixed URL's
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