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post #1 of 84 Old 11-21-2005, 9:54 AM Thread Starter
 
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GM - going under?

This has been getting a lot of coverage here. Market share down, insurance and health care up. And Deplhi may well pull the rug away if GM have to bale our the Delphi pension and health scheme.

So what do you guy think? Going to happen or not?
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post #2 of 84 Old 11-21-2005, 9:55 AM
 
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Re: GM - going under?

(Moved to Cars/Trucks Forum.)
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post #3 of 84 Old 11-21-2005, 10:00 AM Thread Starter
 
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Re: GM - going under?

Sorry, didn't know there was one
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post #4 of 84 Old 11-21-2005, 10:17 AM
 
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Re: GM - going under?

I think the unions are finally getting their way. Now that I got that out of my system, I also think GM has done a crap job with their line of cars.

It's been getting press here too. I think oldfogey posted a link awhile back where GM had sold a whole bunch of notes to get some desperately needed cash.

But I don't think GM will go under.



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post #5 of 84 Old 11-21-2005, 10:20 AM
 
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Re: GM - going under?

Interesting though that the list of plants includes Spring Hill, TN which I think is the only Saturn plant

Must obey the sheep dog
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post #6 of 84 Old 11-21-2005, 10:40 AM
 
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Re: GM - going under?

It seems odd that such a massive company would close its doors
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post #7 of 84 Old 11-21-2005, 10:43 AM
 
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Re: GM - going under?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrX954
It seems odd that such a massive company would close its doors
They won't. The worst that'd happen is they are bought by another company.

And that I do think is possible.



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post #8 of 84 Old 11-21-2005, 11:01 AM
 
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Re: GM - going under?

Yeah, they'll either get bought out or get a government bailout.
GM should have broken union ties years ago. This is just another of the multitude of companies unions have killed or brought to the brink.
I agree with L2L that GM just flat hasn't brought anything exciting to the table lately. Styling every bit as bland, boring and ugly as Toyota - but without anything special to attract buyers.
Then there are the engineers hampered by what the unions will build.
Sad story.
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post #9 of 84 Old 11-21-2005, 11:04 AM
 
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Re: GM - going under?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BDA116
GM should have broken union ties years ago. This is just another of the multitude of companies unions have killed or brought to the brink.
From yahoo today:

"The plant closings aren't expected to be final until GM's current contract with the United Auto Workers expires in 2007."

What a bunch of ****. They can't even close "their" own plants unless the union allows them.



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post #10 of 84 Old 11-21-2005, 11:30 AM Thread Starter
 
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Re: GM - going under?

Yes, it looks like the unions have sucessfully negotiated them selves out of a job. It's reoprted that health and pension liabilities add $3500 to the cost of each car made
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post #11 of 84 Old 11-21-2005, 11:32 AM
 
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Re: GM - going under?

The parasites have fully crippled their host.



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post #12 of 84 Old 11-21-2005, 11:40 AM
 
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Re: GM - going under?

Proto, you have to distinguish between Chapter 11 and bankruptcy as we understand it in the UK. Chapter 11 enables protection from creditors and allows company managements to go to court to break contracts that contribute to the likelihood of bankruptcy.

GM's main competitive disadvantages are its union contracts and the historic health care and pensions costs for former employees. The former would be breakable under Chapter 11, the last can be off-loaded onto the government and taxpayers.

GM is quite a way from Chapter 11 yet, but Delphi's move into Chapter 11 has moved the potential closer.

Once the contracts are changed and the liabilities reduced, there's a healthy business someone would want to own IMHO.
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post #13 of 84 Old 11-21-2005, 11:43 AM
 
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Re: GM - going under?

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldfogey
Proto, you have to distinguish between Chapter 11 and bankruptcy as we understand it in the UK. Chapter 11 enables protection from creditors and allows company managements to go to court to break contracts that contribute to the likelihood of bankruptcy.

GM's main competitive disadvantages are its union contracts and the historic health care and pensions costs for former employees. The former would be breakable under Chapter 11, the last can be off-loaded onto the government and taxpayers.

GM is quite a way from Chapter 11 yet, but Delphi's move into Chapter 11 has moved the potential closer.

Once the contracts are changed and the liabilities reduced, there's a healthy business someone would want to own IMHO.
Thanks for the learned post.



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post #14 of 84 Old 11-21-2005, 11:48 AM
 
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Re: GM - going under?

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldfogey
...

GM's main competitive disadvantages are its union contracts and the historic health care and pensions costs for former employees.....
THis is why the US has lost a chunk of its auto-manufacturing industry slowly to Canada. Strangely enough, out socialized medicare winds up being a big advantage for our economy, in that respect.

GM's product line for '06, especially in cars, is leaps and bounds ahead of where it has been recently... They still seem out of touch with the market though. The Zarella era of P&G 'brand management' needs to give way to a total focus on product. I think they're on the right path, but there is this matter of the UAW to take care of...

And then there's this asshole...
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post #15 of 84 Old 11-21-2005, 11:50 AM
 
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Re: GM - going under?

I thought the SSR was kinda neat looking. Haven't seen the inside of one, or looked at one on the lot though.

Uncle and cousin both owned Grand Prix and they were pretty good cars. Not too bad looking, good brakes (by American car standards, GREAT brakes) good reliability, reasonable milage and very comfortable. But the General has made so many dogs recently, it's hard to notice the good stuff.



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