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View Poll Results: Iraq Rebuild Dollars - Loan or Grant?
Money spent should be a grant. 3 33.33%
Money spent should be a loan. 6 66.67%
Voters: 9. You may not vote on this poll

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post #1 of 14 Old 10-17-2003, 10:17 AM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Iraq Rebuild Dollars

Concerning the vote in the US Senate and House today.

Do you think dollars spent in Iraq should be a loan or a grant?

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post #2 of 14 Old 10-17-2003, 10:39 AM
 
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Re: Iraq Rebuild Dollars

I doubt very highly that many US members would vote 'grant'. Is this the $86,000,000,000.00 you're talking about? Did anyone else see the recent 60 minutes show on the former inspectors, US nuclear warfare experts, former leading foreign affairs advisors's remarks to Powell's evidence speech at UN versus the 'real' reports? Ooops, is this political? Sorry.
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post #3 of 14 Old 10-17-2003, 10:51 AM
 
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Re: Iraq Rebuild Dollars

My personal feeling is that it should be a loan.
That said, Diplomatically it can't be a loan. If we were to go in there and say, 'here's some money, pay it back with interest' there would be a huge cry of 'see, the US only wants Iraq's money'. There are still a bunch of moronic individuals that truly believe money was the reason for the war, and if we make this a loan, they win. The entire Muslim world would look down on it (again, I personally could care less about that), and would further the rift in some nations.
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post #4 of 14 Old 10-17-2003, 10:58 AM
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Re: Iraq Rebuild Dollars

I do not think it really matters.
Here is what happens.

The government takes our $$, and appoints it to rebuild Iraq.
That money is then given to their friends who own the huge companies that will rebuilt the country.
Again the poor are put down, and the rich get more.
I highly doubt we'll ever see that money again.

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post #5 of 14 Old 10-17-2003, 11:19 AM
 
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Re: Iraq Rebuild Dollars

My personal feeling is that it should be a grant. The Bush administration's position has always been that we were not attacking the 'people' of Iraq nor would we seek to control their oil revenues. The Bush administration's position has been that we attcked Iraq (1) to locate WDM; (2) to prevent terrorism; and/or (3) to free the Iraqi people from Saddam. In any case, we attacked and destroyed much of their infrastructure. Now, for Congress to say that the people of Iraq should repay us for the honor of destroying their infrastructure seems like a slap in the face and is contradictory to our stated foreign policy. My thought is that we as a country are morally obligated to rebuild that country because, right or wrong, we attacked. In fact, our history supports such a position. Even though we were not the aggressors during WWII, we rebuilt Germany and Japan . . . and they didn't pay us a dime. I don't think the Iraqi 'people' owe us anything. My 2 cents.

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post #6 of 14 Old 10-17-2003, 11:32 AM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Iraq Rebuild Dollars

Quote:
SuperDave : I doubt very highly that many US members would vote 'grant'. *Is this the $86,000,000,000.00 you're talking about? *Did anyone else see the recent 60 minutes show on the former inspectors, US nuclear warfare experts, former leading foreign affairs advisors's remarks to Powell's evidence speech at UN versus the 'real' reports? *Ooops, is this political? *Sorry.
I am speculating that the poll will be evenly split.....60/40 at the most.....

No need to apologize for political....actually we have been on a fairly good track for discussing volatile topics in a controllable manner lately.

FWIW, I feel it should be a grant, and voted accordingly.


Edit:
Just read MotoP's post......




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post #7 of 14 Old 10-17-2003, 11:56 AM
 
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Re: Iraq Rebuild Dollars

Quote:
BDA116 : My personal feeling is that it should be a loan.
That said, Diplomatically it can't be a loan. If we were to go in there and say, 'here's some money, pay it back with interest' there would be a huge cry of 'see, the US only wants Iraq's money'. There are still a bunch of moronic individuals that truly believe money was the reason for the war, and if we make this a loan, they win. The entire Muslim world would look down on it (again, I personally could care less about that), and would further the rift in some nations.
There are still a bunch of moronic individuals that truly believe the people of the United States were lied to by our President and his staff as to the reasoning/justification of war (while alienating us from the UN and many others). I am so furious after watching the story of the information given to Powell and how it was tipped completely upside down to favor the political agenda at hand. Did they not believe the experts wouldn't stand up afterwards and state that the information in that speech was not what they researched and reported on, but in fact - purposely fabricated/manipulated? For money? maybe - No. Other agendas? Yes.

Refridgeration trucks (Biological warfare proof) from satellite photos were actually firetrucks, confiscated alumimun pipes (attempted Nuclear Warfare production proof) that experts deemed incapable for core use - material more consistant with long range rocket material. The list goes on and on.
Did the US ultimately do the right thing? ???
Are we proud of our courageous Armed Forces? No question.
Did the US Administration decieve the public/world into doing their right thing? Yes

Who's paying for it? Guess.

The poll should be: Should an impeachment investigation have already begun?

It's only 86 or 87 billion, we've got TRILLIONS left! Or is it...trillions in debt? One of those two.
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post #8 of 14 Old 10-17-2003, 12:01 PM
 
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Re: Iraq Rebuild Dollars


Nice try. If you're gonna turn it into one of these, threads, I'm done with it.
Be furious all you want, but it's only your opinion. The facts are there to support the war, 60 minutes always shows what they want to show.
Get the truth, then come back.
Until then, I'm done trying to educate those that are unwilling and unable to be.
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post #9 of 14 Old 10-17-2003, 12:08 PM
 
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Re: Iraq Rebuild Dollars

Good boy BDA! Yea don't get huffed up, it's just my opinion and 60 minutes isn't the only source. Thanks for letting ME vent. (whispering - but he did lie to us all)
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post #10 of 14 Old 10-17-2003, 12:22 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Iraq Rebuild Dollars

Quote:
SuperDave : The poll should be: *Should an impeachment investigation have already begun?
Then by all means, go create that poll....

My question was not about events that led us here, but instead, how we should pay for it....loan or grant.

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post #11 of 14 Old 10-17-2003, 12:39 PM
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Re: Iraq Rebuild Dollars

I'd suggest that it be a grant, but that the U.S. should not be the only country sending money and people to aid in the rebuilding effort. Keep in mind that the Iraqi people in general do not even want us there. However, I'm sure they wouldn't mint some schools, hospitals, and improved infrastructure.

Perhaps instead of a 'loan', Iraq can return the favor with favorable oil prices for the U.S...
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post #12 of 14 Old 10-17-2003, 1:17 PM
 
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Re: Iraq Rebuild Dollars

Quote:
Baketech : Quote (SuperDave @ Oct. 17 2003, 10:56am)The poll should be: *Should an impeachment investigation have already begun?
Then by all means, go create that poll....

My question was not about events that led us here, but instead, how we should pay for it....loan or grant.
My question was more of a rhetorical question, I knew what you were asking, sorry - I just vented a little.
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post #13 of 14 Old 10-17-2003, 2:03 PM
 
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Re: Iraq Rebuild Dollars

Quote:
BDA116 : Get the truth, then come back.
Until then, I'm done trying to educate those that are unwilling and unable to be.
BDA, then where are those WMD's that you assured us they had found? *I remember you telling us specifically that they had them?




22 days until it begins...
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post #14 of 14 Old 10-17-2003, 2:56 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Iraq Rebuild Dollars

Looks like they approved the 87B....but the status of a portion of it to be treated as a loan is to be decided later.

Quote
WASHINGTON (CNN) -- The House approved Friday a $87 billion spending bill for Iraq and Afghanistan. The Senate was expected to follow suit later Friday, but its version of the bill has one key provision opposed by the White House -- converting some of the reconstruction money into loans, as opposed to grants, for Iraq.

The House cleared its bill by a 303-125 vote, and its version follows the White House's wishes in keeping all of the reconstruction money as grants.

That means the question of loans versus grants is not settled as the two bills must be reconciled in a conference committee.

Late Thursday, the Senate approved the loan provision and eight Republicans joined that bipartisan effort to force Iraq to repay about half of the $20 billion in reconstruction funds. That $10 billion would only be an outright grant if other nations forgive the vast majority of Iraq's existing debts.

That amendment passed by a vote of 51 to 47.

One of the amendment's co-sponsor, Sen. Evan Bayh, D-Indiana, said it was designed not to saddle Iraq with more debt, but to encourage other nations, including France and Germany, to forgive debts incurred during Saddam Hussein's dictatorship.
SNIPPED

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