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post #1 of 47 Old 12-18-2003, 9:18 PM Thread Starter
 
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Job offer - Counter Offer

So I've been given a job offer w/ a different company.

It was an okay offer, but not too much more than I'm making now. The deal is that it is w/ a much smaller company and much more risk is involved. I really want the job and am going to go regardless, but I need to counter their offer or I know that I will regret it.

I'd be interested to hear anyone's experience in this area, and advice is always welcome. I've never countered an offer before and am just a little nervous about it.

Thanks all.

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post #2 of 47 Old 12-18-2003, 9:43 PM
 
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Re: Job offer - Counter Offer

Just try to deter your mind from thinking straight $. Keep in mind the working environment, it plays a big part. If it doesn't feel right, the $ won't heal the hatred of going in there everyday if you don't like it. I will admit, throwing them a counter offer in this economy is ballsy, Good luck bro.

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post #3 of 47 Old 12-18-2003, 10:03 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Job offer - Counter Offer

Quote:
Originally Posted by booth23
Just try to deter your mind from thinking straight $. Keep in mind the working environment, it plays a big part. If it doesn't feel right, the $ won't heal the hatred of going in there everyday if you don't like it. I will admit, throwing them a counter offer in this economy is ballsy, Good luck bro.

"Ballsy". Honest, good advice. The thing is that I have a very stable job now. I don't HAVE to leave. I'm leaving for the opportunity to learn more and play a bigger role. Like I said, I'm going to take the job regardless, but what can it hurt to counter an offer? What are the chances that they are going to walk away from the original offer? The way I see it the worst they can do is say "Sorry this is the best we can do." and I would say "Okay, I'll take it then. Thanks for trying.".

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post #4 of 47 Old 12-18-2003, 10:10 PM
 
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Re: Job offer - Counter Offer

I'm with booth, look at the overall picture, not just the numbers. If they made you a better offer than you have now, then you've already got the finances covered. Worry about the rest, and once all that is broken down to you try to haggle a littlebit. Tell them that if they give you $XXXX more you'd feel a little better. Worst they can say is "no." It can never hurt to try.

When I took my current job the very first "offer" HR made me was what I asked for from my boss and was still able to talk them up a bit. Never hurts to try. Even if they only meet you halfway to your difference, it's still a victory!

Good luck bro
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post #5 of 47 Old 12-18-2003, 10:41 PM
 
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Re: Job offer - Counter Offer

I am going through the EXACT same thing right now. The new company sought me out and made me an offer. I had met them before and they looked me up. I sent in a counter offer this morning but haven't heard back from them yet. Their innitial offer was 20% more than what I make now but they wouldn't know that. My counter offer would put me at 30% more than what I make now. How's that for ballsy. The worst they can say is no and I we will come to some agreement in the middle. All info I have gotten so far has stated that you should ask for more than you think you are worth. Almost everyone underestimates their value. I got most of my information from this site.

This page has tons of salary negotiation links. I would read them all.

Careers.org

This link has a sample counter offer along with most of the same other info about salary negotiation.

Making a Counter Offer

Hope that helps you. I hope we both get tons of cash and jobs with greater opportunities.

Then we can buy more bikes!

-Shrub

To the optimist, the glass is half full. To the pessimist, the glass is half empty. To the engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

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post #6 of 47 Old 12-19-2003, 12:05 AM
 
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Re: Job offer - Counter Offer

Always ask for more...or alternate packages...like health, pension, car...etc...it also depends on your experience and skills....if you are in a senior role...you can NOT go in cheap...Would you trust a guy in a senior role that comes in for only $20/hour. Or if they asked for $110/hour...you would think he is coming in with skills and the confidence to ask for a higher rate. Obviously, your actual rate will be dependent on your experience!!!! As Wet says...people tend to underestimate...

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post #7 of 47 Old 12-19-2003, 12:24 AM
 
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Re: Job offer - Counter Offer

There is nothing wrong with coming back with a counter offer (I do it all the time ). What you need though are solid reasons why they should give you more money. State your reasons such as comparing your current salary if they already know it, benefits, your experience that you bring them. Salary average's of the position. If you give them solid reasons generally you will get it. If you feel nervous doing this person to person then put it into an email or a letter.

Just make sure you add that you are very excited about the opportunity and want to keep the door open for further discussion.

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post #8 of 47 Old 12-19-2003, 8:21 AM
 
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Re: Job offer - Counter Offer

I agree with fl. I did what you're about to do. I wanted off the road, traveling from site to site all over NorthEast Ohio (can you say road rage?). Anyway, I countered just a tad and gave in immediately. I regretted that move to this day. Why? They needed me, which is why they offered me the job (saved them some serious dollars) and it was to be a win win situation for both of us. Years later I had to fight, kick, scratch to get raises even to get close what the market was paying. I finally achieved what I believe to be fair but it would have been a hell of a lot easier to negotiate better in the beginning (once you're in, they own all the cards - unless you're ready to accept resigning and search again). What makes me say this? Well after a couple years the exact same scenario came up and they wanted this Network Manager (saving them big bucks versus contracted services). They made him an offer and he basically laughed at it and said no thanks. The company eventually caved in to HIS demand AND negotiated vacation (which they told me vacation was non-negotiable). I was outraged at first, then just accepted there was no one to blame except myself.

My point (after this long read LOL ) is negotiate to the point where you don't jeopardize your future job but fight for what you believe is fair (research pay scales comparable). Like I said, once you're in - it's much more difficult to ask for more. Unless you're good at golfing with the VPs and CEO!!!!!
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post #9 of 47 Old 12-19-2003, 8:40 AM
 
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Re: Job offer - Counter Offer

Giving a counter offer is not a bad way to go at all. Just don't box yourself into a corner (give me this amount or else) and be prepaired to say thanks anyway if things don't work out. It's like buying a car. When you really want the car you never seem to get the deal you want. When you can take or leave the car, the deals just seem to come.
Good luck.
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post #10 of 47 Old 12-19-2003, 8:43 AM
 
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Re: Job offer - Counter Offer

SD...good point about the vacation.
Once you have built up 4-5 weeks somewhere, it's hard to go back to just 2 weeks....

If you have a life outside of work, it becomes important to negotiate vacation time if at all possible. Some companies will tell you that it's a fixed rule, but many times it can be waived. If they refuse to budge, "ask" if you can take uncompensated time off, in exchange for a equitably higher salary. I've seen this work....it all just depends where they are able to bend...

Edit:
That link Wetshrub posted on "countering" was excellent...

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post #11 of 47 Old 12-19-2003, 9:28 AM
 
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Re: Job offer - Counter Offer

I believe as a hiring manager that most organizations expect that any decent canidate will be prepared to negotiate the final compensation package. It shows leadership and willingness to manage the process. So, I'd suggest that you first develop a clear understanding of the job requirements and then sell them on how and what you bring to the table not only to meet but exceed the expectation. Articulate your value thru examples and references. They be unable due to budget constraints to move on salary. Under those conditions...try negotiating more vacation time, etc. I've used this with a lot of success.

I also agree that pay is only one aspect...the total compensation package including benefits, work atmosphere, commute, etc., needs to weigh in your on your final decision. Sounds like you're ready for the move. Best of luck!
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post #12 of 47 Old 12-19-2003, 9:41 AM
 
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Re: Job offer - Counter Offer

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fearj

I also agree that pay is only one aspect...the total compensation package including benefits, work atmosphere, commute, etc., needs to weigh in your on your final decision. Sounds like you're ready for the move. Best of luck!
Yes, agreed. Don't get me wrong, I love the work enviroment I'm at now versus the traveling. Work is about 10 minute drive, traffic is when there are more than 5 cars in front of me! Good people, excellent boss (Network Manager btw). Just don't go in thinking I'll start as low as they want and I'll prove to them how great I am and they'll recognize it and reward me as needed. Not going to happen (at least from my experience).

fearj - raptor huh? Always wanted to get one and from what I read - they freakin fly! Oh and any job openings? I work hard when not on the Fireblade site!
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post #13 of 47 Old 12-19-2003, 9:57 AM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Job offer - Counter Offer

Thanks all for your responses. Some very good advice here. I did read the article posted by WetShrub and it was good. However, there wasn't too much there that anyone w/ good writing skills doesn't know. My oppinion anyway.

UPDATE: I want the job. I am going to accept regardless. Everything is ay-okay except the base salary. I sent a counter about an hour ago explaining that I really liked the company/opportunity/people(I have worked w/ their Cheif Software Architecht)/benefits/vacation etc. The commute is good too. However, there is much more risk involved. I'd be going from Fortune 200 to 3.5 year old .COM. That is nothing to take lightly. I said that for reasons x,y,z I felt that I wanted my salary to be $this amount, and that it was important that whatever agreement we came to BOTH of us had to feel good about it.

I don't expect to get what I asked for, but I expect to get more than they originally offered.

HD

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post #14 of 47 Old 12-19-2003, 9:59 AM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Job offer - Counter Offer

Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperDave
Just don't go in thinking I'll start as low as they want and I'll prove to them how great I am and they'll recognize it and reward me as needed. Not going to happen (at least from my experience).
This has been my experience too. I don't want to fall into that trap again.

HD

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post #15 of 47 Old 12-19-2003, 10:09 AM
 
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Re: Job offer - Counter Offer

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heavy-Dee
Thanks all for your responses. Some very good advice here. I did read the article posted by WetShrub and it was good. However, there wasn't too much there that anyone w/ good writing skills doesn't know. My oppinion anyway.

UPDATE: I want the job. I am going to accept regardless. Everything is ay-okay except the base salary. I sent a counter about an hour ago explaining that I really liked the company/opportunity/people(I have worked w/ their Cheif Software Architecht)/benefits/vacation etc. The commute is good too. However, there is much more risk involved. I'd be going from Fortune 200 to 3.5 year old .COM. That is nothing to take lightly. I said that for reasons x,y,z I felt that I wanted my salary to be $this amount, and that it was important that whatever agreement we came to BOTH of us had to feel good about it.

I don't expect to get what I asked for, but I expect to get more than they originally offered.

HD
Sounds like you've covered the bases. Good luck
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