ok, i know this has been covered many many times before. i have most of the evening tonight looking at past threads but dont seem to be getting the info / answers that may steer me right.

at present....

i had the cct replaced with oem honda one around 2 years ago, since then i have done maybe 8000 miles. mainly commuting, with some fast road blasts nothing over 200miles in one go.

she is now making the same noise she did when i had the cct replaced then, between 2000rpm until around 4000rpm a rattling king of noise can be heard from the upper right hand side of the engine ( just where the cct is ) i am due a valve clearance check ( 26546 miles ) but i do not think it is this as the noise is not noticeable over 4000 rpm.

now i did at one point believe the sound was coming from the valve in the exhaust, i have removed this for the moment to test this theory. the noise does still exist, again still around the same 2000 - 4000 rpm range.

i have read the details about manual tensioners, some good some bad. i have been through the haynes manual but i am still not 100% happy.

as i read it there is no real way to check the cct once you take it out to see if it is at fault other than replacing it with new and seeing if that solves the problem.

if this does not resolve the problem, i am guessing it could be the guides or the chain itself? so before i spend money on a new tensioner, is it worth taking the head off and looking at the state of the chain / guides?

if i did what should i really be looking for? would an extremly slack / worn chain be causing the sound? worn guides?

if i take a look at the state of the chain itself before replacing the cct, obviously tank, airbox, head off to see the state of play. am i likely to need a new gasket when the head comes off, any idea on cost roughly?

thank you all for any advise i am just trying to get my head around the best method of attack before i spend any money on parts not required.

chris

As you know they rattle....at 32,000 i had the rattle and extra vibration through bars and pegs , so had the cam chain looked at, it was shot also both teeth were well worn on the cam gears so replaced them, still rattled a bit but no vibration, yesterday i changed my plugs, found 1 a little loose compared to others and 1 coil pack loose compared to others after change started bike , tick over from cold better tick over when warm better but no more rattle .....go figure:idunno: not saying this is the prob but with a alloy block and frame you just never know were a rattle can come from ..........hope it helps a bit :thumb:

 

she has always made a little noise but not like she is now, with a standard can it is easily heard whilst riding.

with the half laser system i have, you could hear it still.

with the half system and the exhuast valve internals removed it is a lot quieter, but that is due to the lovely note now being given out through the can! but it is still there and only at 2 -4k

 

ok, have looked a bit more tonight and looking around a gasket if i take the head off to look a the cam chain etc is around £35 from david silver spares as an example.

a manual tensioner is £45 plus postage so i think i will go that route. is there any how to guides liek the haynes manuals on here anyone has put up have searched but have not found anything.

though the haynes is good, i find pictures taken by people doign the work themself show a lot more!

 

ok, have looked a bit more tonight and looking around a gasket if i take the head off to look a the cam chain etc is around £35 from david silver spares as an example.

a manual tensioner is £45 plus postage so i think i will go that route. is there any how to guides liek the haynes manuals on here anyone has put up have searched but have not found anything.

though the haynes is good, i find pictures taken by people doing the work themself show a lot more!

You do not remove the head to check the camchain.
You only remove the valve cover which is a simple rubber gasket for US$35.

 

thanks for the heads up! would you think going the manual tensioner route first would still be the best option?

 

I don't know what you mean by "first" but I like the peace of mind of the manual tensioner.

 

sorry when i say first, i mean purchase a manual tensioner and fit that before removing the valve cover and checking the cam chain etc.

if it is going to cost £35 for a gasket, and i then open her up to find all is well and it is the tensioner that is at fault it is kind of £35 wasted where as if i buy a manual tensioner and try that first, if that does not do the trick i know i have more work to do.

but in the long rong the tensioners are prone to failure so i would think that is my better starting route is to purchase a manual tensioner as i am likely to need another at some point in my blades life.

thanks for your advise in advance, it is a good help.

 

You shouldn't need to replace the valve cover gasket unless you damage it, which is unlikely.
I would think if you're merely trying to quieten it you would need to replace the chain itself.

 

so if the gasket is likely to remain in one piece, first option is to remove the cover and inspect the chain. what are the major signs of wear on this part?

i am assuming if i can lift the chain by large amounts then that is a sign it is on its way out? is there a life expectany for this part or are they rather like the tensioner itself?

thanks again

 

so if the gasket is likely to remain in one piece, first option is to remove the cover and inspect the chain. what are the major signs of wear on this part?

i am assuming if i can lift the chain by large amounts then that is a sign it is on its way out? is there a life expectany for this part or are they rather like the tensioner itself?

thanks again

The rule of thumb I learned years ago for drivechain was 2% but I doubt I ever run my chains that far. To avoid removing the chain you can simply measure across 21 pins (centre to centre). Each link of a 5-series chain is 15.875mm so 20 links will be 317.5mm. If you pull the chain tight (in gear and pull against the wheel) and measure more than 324mm I'd consider the chain is due for replacement.
I'd expect the camchain to be getting noisy long before it reached its maximum wear limit though. I don't know offhand what the pitch of the 929/954 camchain is but you can measure it off one link yourself.

 

so if it does not appear to be worn, but just noisy. would a manual tensioner have enough 'adjustment' to make the noise quieter / go away or is it a noise that i should just learn to live with?

thanks again for all of your info

 

so if it does not appear to be worn, but just noisy. would a manual tensioner have enough 'adjustment' to make the noise quieter / go away or is it a noise that i should just learn to live with?

thanks again for all of your info

Noise supression is not the purpose of the tensioner.
The tensioner is designed to keep the chain correctly tensioned to keep the engine accurately timed allowing it operate within close piston-to-valve tolerances.
Over-tensioning the chain will probably quieten it but is not good for the engine or the chain itself.
Have you listened to other 929 engines to determine if yours has a problem?
The tensioner itself can become noisy over time due to wear so replacing it can quieten that, and will also indirectly quieten the chain by applying the correct tension.

 

I know you all may laught at this but ive had my cct changed and was still getting the same old tapping,it all came down to the plugs had them changed noise (tappin) gone...sad but true

 

If the plugs were loose I'd expect a tapping sound.
Usually the plug blows out of the engine eventually.

 

I have the exact same noise and i had the cam chain tensioner done. Mine is wirse when it's cold. But if i pull the clutch in goes away someone who knows these things inside out say's the clutch basket rattles and you can't do anything about it. But if there is an answer please let me know. Cheers Jamesy.

 

The damper springs in the back of the clutch basket become loose over time and will rattle when the clutch is unloaded.
Nothing to worry about.

 

Cheers, Can you change them or is it not worth bothering with. Another question my bike wont start. Help required. It will turn over and prime the fuel but wont fire it does have spark. Any ideas guys? I stripped the plastics off to look at the wiring there was an indicator wire touching the frame would this stop it from starting? Cheers jamesy.:thumbd:

 

Honda don't sell them and it requires drilling out the rivets to disassemble the basket but it is possible to stretch the springs or shim them and reassemble it. They will still rattle again eventually though so it's really not worth doing anything about.
It has spark and the pump is priming but it doesn't fire?
Very strange.
What happened to the bike before it stopped running?
Does it have a Power Commander?
Can you see fuel spraying out of the injectors?
No, it could possibly blow the fuse for the lighting circuit but it won't affect the ignition system.

 

It was running ok it does have a PC3 which was on it when i got it, it's never missed a beat then suddenly it wouldn't fire up. after flicking the kill switch about 20 times it ran but when you touched the throttle it wanted to die but once it was going it was fine brought it back home now it won't start. Charging the battery fully at the moment. I did disconnect the PC but still the same?

 

My guess is that somebody has been using the killswitch to stop the engine instead of using the ignition switch.
If you use the killswitch regularly it will fail as it is not designed for daily use.
Try bypassing the killswitch and see if that helps.

 

That would be me. I always have. Bloody thing i think my mate has a spare kill switch. Never thought using it would burn it out. Think you have just hit the nail on the head.... Will go and bypass it see if it fires up. Jamesy.

 

Still can't get it going i have the kill switch in bits but how do you bypass it there is a small module on the assembly with two spade connectors going into it?

 

The easiest way is to simply poke a pin through both wires to bridge them. A quick splice snap lock connector also works well.
10 Electrical Wire / Cable Snap Lock Splice Connectors - eBay Other Security Electrical, Security Electrical, Car Accessories, Vehicle Parts Accessories. (end time 21-Jul-10 09:37:29 AEST)

 

Another update after a new battery and turning it over it eventually fired up and ran, funny thing is when i touched the throttle it died any ideas?

 

Thanks, Tried it still wont start. The FI light goes out and the red light on the clocks goes out then it comes back on and stays solid. God i hate when it wont go. When it started and ran it ran fine but its as if when i gave it a blip of the throttle it was either starved with fuel or air any ideas my friend?

 

If the MIL is on solid then you need to pull the codes by bridging the diagnostics connector.
You can't blip it or give it light throttle?

 

Stupid question now. Where is the diagnostic connector?

 

Under the seat.

 

I did see a connector under there. But i am still learning about the blade lol. Cheers will try it. Battery is on charge again. I want to see it run again as it's too much money sitting doing nothing. Cheers for the advice without this site i would be stuffed.

 

I just did that its flashing fault code 9, 12, 13, 14 and 15 any ideas wht so many?

 

Yep, sounds like the injection harness is loose.

 

Found the fault codes on here. It's saying that all the injectors are loose or have a poor connection. Now i will have to take the tank of and have a right good look at the wiring. Was hoping that it was something simply.

 

Cheers for the info will keep you updated, time for the tank to come off. If you get stuck with peugeots i know them in and out ha ha.

 

I would like to think I'm smart enough not to get stuck with a Peugeot

 

Well looks like i am the smart one. Bike is now running advice everyone take your PC3's and throw them away. there junk. After unplugging the PC3 the bike coughed then ran. Now i have no fault codes either. Thanks for all your help Blade Racer. will send you some pics drop me a line at jamesys@live.co.uk cheers.

 

I forgot you were running a PC.
Like all electrical parts they are prone to failure.

 

Interesting info guys. I to have had concerns regarding tapping noises. Have always thought it to be my cam chain or tensioner but now may look elsewhere.
Thanks, Bob

 

Hi Bob, in return there are issues with tappets on these machines around 25-30,000 miles. The way i checked my noices are pull the clutch in at cold start if the rattle gets alot better. It's the clutch basket. I had the cam chain tensioner fitted at Honda and it made no difference.

 

What are you referring to as the tappets? I am referring to a tapping noise. Nothing in rithym with the bike's rpm and does not go away when I start to let the clutch out and start to get a load on drive train. I was actually thinking of trying a manual tensioner so if someone could advise how they function I would appreciate it.
Thanks, Bob

 

Tappets usually refers to hydraulic valve lifters but is often used to describe the shim buckets in our engines as well.
Modern valve systems rarely get loose enough to become noisy, they normally tighten up.
The manual tensioner is _very_ simple and I make my own.
It's simply a piece of 8mm aluminium plate cut to fit over the tensioner hole with a hole threaded through it. An M8 stainless sockethead bolt goes through the hole and you simply tighten it up against the chain guide and lock it in place with a locknut. I make an aluminium "boot" that consists of a short length of 12mm aluminium rod rounded on the end with an 8mm hole drilled down most of its length and a 6mm bearing dropped in. It's probably not required but for me it ensures the pulsing of the chain guide doesn't wear against the end of the bolt.

 

O/K Ive seen something like this before. Is there a need to rotate the crank and visually watch the tensioner for the most worn area of the chain or do I have this all wrong?
Bob

 

Probably not a bad idea but it shouldn't be necessary. The camchain operates within a sealed enviroment and in a constant oil bath so it wears much more evenly than a drive chain does.
Check the tension on the adjuster regularly - during your oil changes is a good time.