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I've owned two other Hondas before this one, but this is the 1st "New" bike I have purchased. I just bought a 08 1000. I've looked in the manual to find out the proper break-in period. The book stated was to avoid quick acceleration and not to read line the bike for the first 300 miles.
What kind of RPM ranges do you run your motors, and how long do you consider "the break in" period to be?
 

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I recently bought a new 07 1000RR. I was told to keep it under 8000 rpm for the first 600 miles. Nothing about quick accelerations.
 

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Anytime that i have purchased a bike, i have always varied the RPMs that i run, from very low while cruising, to rolling on very high. Never a problem. The rings need to go through heat cycles from what i know and a constant speed and low RPM isnt gonna help that along i dont think.
 

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Why do the manufacturers recommend an easy break in? It seems that they should know & have nothing to gain by dispensing mistruths. A freind of mine cooked his engine because he was sold on "moto man's" hard break in theory. They told him it looked like the engine had been run without oil.
Luckily the dealer was friendly & billed the engine replacement to suzuki. If you decide that you should try the "hard break in" good luck to ya.
 

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I would bet that he over did it. Of course I don't know, but if you do it exactly as motoman states, and CHANGE THE OIL very early on (20 to 50 miles) it should never give you a problem. You have to get the metal shavings out of the oil so they can't contaminate the rest of the system. during the break in you can't change the oil too often or too soon. If it was a bearing failure, the hard run would not have had an effect on whether the engine failed or not. The problem with mass produced engines is that every assembly is rarely quality checked. they do it in cycles- every 50th or 200th engine. this can allow for one or two engines that are barely outside the tolerances to slip through. Think about this... Every component of your bike has a tolerance. what happens if the crankshaft journal is at the largest the tolerance allows, at the same time, one of the bearings is at the thickest the tolerance allows? it causes the clearances to shrink. when these clearances shrink, less oil is allowed into the passage. On a four cycle engine, the moving parts should not touch the bearing. What really happens is the oil pressure causes the oil to surround and push against the journal. When the engine is running, the journal actually rides on the oil not the bearing. this is why when you build an engine you have to prime the oil pump to get oil in all the bearings so they don't burn on the initial start up. When less oil is allowed into the passage, and the parts expand while running, you can actually have these parts touch. This kind of failure would show it's face on any engine within just a few hundred miles usually.

when you do the motoman method. You still have to vary the RPM. you can't just go do a top end run and expect the break in to work. Having built quite a few engines myself, I know for a fact that honing tools have gotten quite a bit finer over the past couple decades and the need for long break in periods is not needed any longer. Ask any NASCAR team how long they break their engines in? I bet it's just a few laps on a short track, or a few runs on a dyno. they don't have time to break an engine in over several hundred miles. and the pressures that the moving parts on those engines suffer is way harsher than that of our short stroke engines.
 

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Why do the manufacturers recommend an easy break in? It seems that they should know & have nothing to gain by dispensing mistruths. A freind of mine cooked his engine because he was sold on "moto man's" hard break in theory. They told him it looked like the engine had been run without oil.
Luckily the dealer was friendly & billed the engine replacement to suzuki. If you decide that you should try the "hard break in" good luck to ya.
You do realize that every new bike (and car for that matter) is run before leaving the factory, don't you? What do you think race teams do to break in every engine? The tolerances on new bikes today don't require extended easy break in periods. Can't speak for your friend's bike, but I'm sure there's more to his story...
 

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Yep, a friend in the trade always says to me not too worry as the engine are run at the factory anyway.

My dealer said to use varied revs for the first 600 miles and not go above 6000rpm, even though the manual states 300 mile break in.

I am going with what the delaer says, as it doesn't take long to get to 600 miles, and I feel like I am being kind to my baby.

As for breaking in to get the strongest engine, all a matter of choice I suppose. Somebody could say that the way I break the bike in might result in 3 less hp, like I would notice anyway. :idunno:
 

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Hmm. I have a couple questions then. If every bike is run at the factory why did my two CBR1000RR's only have .2 miles on them. I figured that was put on by the dealer when they put it together and test rode it. Also, how long do you think it takes rings to seat? I'll bet it's not more than 50 or 100 miles. I am ready to change the oil in my two bikes and put Amsoil in them. I have 250 on one and 125 on the other. Anyone see a problem with me doing this so early? I wanted to do it around 50 or 100 miles but held off.
 

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From what I am led to believe, the engines are run before being installed in the chassis. Nowt to do with ODO reading mate.
 

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From what I am led to believe, the engines are run before being installed in the chassis. Nowt to do with ODO reading mate.
So they hook up an exhaust and stuff to make it run? I find that hard to believe. But, I do learn new things every day.
 

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Starting a bike at the factory to check for leaks is one thing. Running it through the gears is another. When we are talking break in. If someone has any answers, please clue me in.
 

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First, every engine gets mounted to a fixture. a fuel system and an exhaust system are applied to the engine. They usually are loaded too with some type of braking device. they are then run to temperature and run through the rpm range. Second, you could make your ODO say 250 miles for the rest of it's life. All you have to do is disconnect the cable that is run to the transmission. You won't know how fast you are going, but your mileage will never change. This could be done at the factory also to check the running gear.

We should get something straight. If you are not worried about max HP, you can use the manual recommended break in. You still want to change your oil early. Most of the break in is done in the initial few minutes of run time... regardless of mileage. the metal shavings are your engines worst enemy. because of the all aluminum blocks these days, and the fact that magnets won't work to trap the shavings. A second oil change at around 100 to 150 miles could also be recomended. those shavings are like sand blasting your bearings and the rest of your moving parts.
 

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i've never seen the motoman site before but he states pretty much what i figured out when i was 15-16 with scooters saw the results with like bikes broken in the recommanded way and my way. I always said race times dont have time to do lengthy breaks either, however they do have alot more money to replace parts too. :)

He has a science that seems to have actual result data. I realized this much in the last ten years or so. If u rise a child soft then it will be soft if u tough it up from an early age it will be that much stronger. not that i have any kids.

My break in period consist of short burst of speed on back roads usually getting up to 50 to 60 mph quickly a good amount of shifting through the gears. I never redlined or anything at about 100 miles i crack it up to 100 mph with a few quick burst then about every 20 or so i get back up to that speed. i will adapt the early oil change which also makes sense as the weak metal will come off quickly rather then excatly 300 miles and suzuki has a about a 200 miles or more they recommand.
 

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You do realize that every new bike (and car for that matter) is run before leaving the factory, don't you? What do you think race teams do to break in every engine? The tolerances on new bikes today don't require extended easy break in periods. Can't speak for your friend's bike, but I'm sure there's more to his story...
:plus1:
 

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That Motoman site has alot of great information on it! Too bad it has not been updated for quite some time! Future articles that he briefly talked of, would be interesting toics of discussion.
 

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I have been looking for information on good run in techniques but haven’t found any so far that actually manage to explain WHY they work. And they few people that claim to have found a magic method usually fall flat on their face when they start to explain it. Before people get me wrong, I don’t propose to know the answer and I am not slandering people like ‘motoman’ I am sure he knows a hell of a lot more about bikes than I do but I am not sure that these ‘gurus’ know as much about it as they say.


The first discrepancy I noticed with run in techniques was this:


I was working in a bike shop while I was a student and (thanks to an open minded manager) we started comparing demo bikes to ‘new’ sold ones with permission on the dyno when they came in for servicing. And there was a noticeable trend difference with the bikes, the demo bikes almost always had lower power [but only a few % less] in the long run (Over 3000 miles) while the demos almost always had more power in the short run (less than 1800 miles, but more so in 1200 or less).


Now, we knew that the bulk of the ‘new’ bikes were broken in using the factory recommendations while the locals here rode the demos fairly hard, almost exactly as most ‘solid’ run-in methods recommend. Noticing this we started changing the oil much more regularly on the demos and had the staff do a motorman style break in for the first 60 miles (corresponding oil changes). Now, the affect of this was to bring the long run power of the demos back in line with the ‘new’ bikes but the trend power was still lower (smalllll amount). So this seems to suggest that unless you want that power RIGHT NOW! You should just follow the factory recommendations as in the long run (and 3000 miles is not that long at all) you will be better off.


Side note: All demos were run on 98 Premium fuel, customers didn’t fill the demos. As far as I know the customers who owned their bikes also used 98 (98 being the readily available ‘Ultimate unleaded’ in Australia).


It’s a hard call to advocate one method over another. The biggest challenge is to separate out all of the variables to know exactly what is causing problems or delivering benefits.


What I often think is this;
1)1) To remove material from any surface you need to do work on it, in this case this work is friction.
2)2) Frictional work is force x the coefficient of friction x distance.

3)3) Distance would be, say, 1 rpm cycle and force would be proportional to the load on the engine.


Now, depending on the scratch hardness of the materials in your engine the break in process can vary widely in terms of what is actually happening. In terms of frictional work, it makes no difference whatsoever to how fast or hard you run your engine during break in as the above relationship shows that you can develop the same amount of work over time.

What does make a difference (and people brush on this without understanding) is heat. Heat can change the force (due to expansion) and can reduce your scratch hardness. This will have the most impact on surfaces that are most often in contact (rings). Now unless you do a full metallurgical analysis on EVERY part in your engine and happen to know how to make use of this information (and I don’t know how, nor would anyone who is not a metallurgical or a specialized mechanical engineer) you can’t be sure if you want to increase the scratch hardness of your cylinders relative to your rings or not.


Now as to the theory that you can ‘use up’ the roughness of your cylinders, this is complete folly. An easy analogy is that of water wearing through rock. Now… water is not ‘rough’ so you don’t need ‘rough’. It’s all just a matter of time. It is possible that the wear distribution may be effected by un-worn sections coming into contact with a worn cylinder section when you finally let rip. But then I would be inclined to counter that with the statement ‘Its total work that counts’ final equilibrium is dictated by total work, not the work distribution. (I am simplifying here, but it works out this way).


Think of it this way, say you have two drill bits and you want to drill through a thick slab of some tough material. Discounting heat (I have talked about that… say you take your time and use a water cooler) do you really think you would be able to drill through more of the slab if you:


1)Use the 1st bit for half its life (half way blunt), then switched to the 2nd bit for half its life, then back to the 1st until it was blunt and then back to the 2nd till its blunt.


Or


2)Use the first till it was blunt and then used the 2nd till it was blunt.


I’ll tell you now it makes no difference at all. By the way, if you do it at a steady sustainable rate even heat makes no difference as heat will reach its equilibrium within a few mins (or secs) even if you sit there for 5hrs it won’t heat up any more than it did in the first few mins.


So what method am I selling? None… I don’t know what works best in the end of the day but I am pointing out a few of the stupid assumptions that people make such as the ‘use up the roughness’ that motorman proposes. There is probably something else going on in there that he is missing. People often see an effect without knowing the affect.



Based on what I have said above you should probably just stick with the factory recommendations. And before anyone flames me about how ‘x-method gets more power’ well I would probably just say that anyone who follows ‘x-method’ is probably changing their oils more often which is the one thing that EVERYONE agrees on. It’s kind of stupid to me that some people will ride their new bikes 600+ miles before the first oil change.


I should probably leave it at that, I could probably go for a few more pages and seem like an even more pompous ass… In the end of the day I would be inclined to believe the Engineers at the factory… they built the things so I am sure they know more than just about anyone else.
 
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